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BT: So Tomio, what do you think about JACL today, then?

TM: Well, I'll be very frank, I was very disappointed when they selected Dave Ushio, so I kind of got out of there real fast.

BT: That was a while ago. [Laughs]

TM: Yeah, but the point is, I was so disappointed in the way that they selected him. He had no experience whatsoever. And, you know, so I was really disappointed in the Nisei leadership for selecting somebody like that that had very little, if any experience. Anyway, so it was just a good time to leave.

KE: What's one piece of information or advice you would want to pass down to the next generation?

TM: Well, I think, to me, JACL or any legitimate organization is good to get involved with because looking back, also after [inaudible] you guys sent me, I said, "What the hell did I get out of JACL?" Well, I'll be very frank. I got up to meet a lot of people and very nice people, you know, just to start off with the JACL. Mas Sato was the executive director, and Masaoka, and then Dan Inouye. But I really admired Sparky Matsunaga. So get to meet a lot, and then, you know, got to meet Norm Mineta, we stay in touch. The point I'm making is JACL is okay. I mean, not to say, but you've got to encourage young people to get involved because you get to meet a lot of different people. As long as it's a legitimate cause, it doesn't matter what the cause is, you meet different people. And in addition, I think without JACL, I would have never met people like Min Yasui and who's our local person? But, you know, I'll be very frank, I did not enjoy meeting or talking to Min Yasui. But the fact is, you know, you get to meet these people and try to understand.

BT: I'm laughing because I have heard stories about Min Yasui from Hood River. But it's also interesting because a lot of the names you've mentioned are, they were personal friends with my father, like Mas Sato and Mike Masaoka and those folks, because my dad was really active in the late '40s and '50s in JACL. And Tomio, I have never considered you out of JACL because even though, because you've always been helpful, and always there. I moved to Seattle in the '80s. And I remember Elena Akagi telling me about how you were deeply involved in the '88 convention and you wanted to have it as, you know, coming home and having at the University of Washington campus and things like that. And I know, even in our last convention in 2012, how you're able to put together with the Hokubei Hochi the hundreds of century, your history of Japanese Americans in the Puget Sound.

TM: In fact, I've got to talk to you, I'd like to see them updated again, you know.

BT: You know, I think that's something that was worthwhile, I think that you should come back to the chapter. But the other thing and just, you know, and have your thought on this, but, you know, JACL has been Japanese-centric, and I remember in the '70s when Asian American became more of a topic. And a lot of people were saying, "Well, we're Japanese Americans, we don't have anything in common with other Asian Americans." But the reality is, how people view us, and there's more people that view us together and that we have very many goals and objectives that are similar, and you're stronger with other folks than you are by yourself, and so that's natural. I think that you know, your company is a prime example to me, of how you can expand successfully. Because Uwajimaya was always considered -- when I first moved here -- as a Japanese grocery store. And you've successfully kept the Japanese American name and association, but at the same time, have marketed yourself very successfully as an Asian grocery store. And I think that's something that JACL can emulate, and I think that we try to do that. And so I'm kind of curious, because you've also mentioned some of the old leaders, but what do you think about some of our new leaders like Sarah Baker, or Akemi Matsumoto is not new but...

TM: Well, she's my second cousin.

BT: Oh, you know, people, Tatsuo Nakata and folks like that, and I think that Joy Shigaki, these people have been leading us into, you know, keeping us vibrant, in my opinion. What do you think?

TM: Well, I just haven't been too involved, you know, I've been so busy with my own business. You know, I think I kind of did what I did and then moved on. But, you know, like I say, I was just turned off by JACL. But having said that, you know, I had the opportunity to meet people like JD and Irene Hirano, you know, they were all fringe interested in JACL. But, Irene is, for an example, started to realize that JACL was not going to be overly concerned with relations with Japan, so she kind of started her own. Because the point I'm making on that is that element is important. You know, it may not be current to JACL, but you can't ignore it, you know. And this is where Irene, we didn't have extensive talk, but I stayed in touch with her and I supported her for that. And so the point I'm just making is that JACL has now become more of a social type of issues, which is fine, but there is still need for, you know, organizations or relations to Japan, because that's where our culture is. Especially for me, that's where my business core is. So that's why... we struggled with this issue, too. Just to give you an example, you know, just to give you one example, we have ramen from Korea, do you put it in the Korean section, or do you put it in the ramen section? I mean, that's just one example of how we have to struggle with all this. Fortunately, you know, most customers, they don't care as long as they find the damn thing. But those are issues that we had to deal with internally.

BT: I was smiling because when I go to Uwajimaya, I'm very particular about what I buy. [Laughs]

KE: Me too.

TM: Well, you know, the other thing is, it's easy to just buy the cheapest thing. But here again, it's a conscious decision to try to sell not on price, but on quality. But then you have to, you know, you can't just triple your... so there's those are issues that we have struggled with, those are the challenges we have to deal with. And, you know, I don't know. But I'll be very frank, when my daughter was selected by the board to be the CEO, I said, "I'm out of here," because I didn't think my daughter wanted me to be sitting at the same board table, so I got out of there, and they seem to be doing fine.

BT: She got a prestigious award the other, a couple months ago, yeah.

<End Segment 5> - Copyright © 2020 Seattle Chapter JACL. All Rights Reserved.