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CN: So moving on just a little bit past the war, I was wondering if you could talk about some of the accomplishments of Seattle JACL that you and Phil were involved in. And I know that that's also like in the documents that you sent. But like if you had a little more insight about how he felt about this fight for justice that he was involved in as well.

LH: At that time, Phil was in JACL in the, in the early '60s, and he also served as president of the JACL at one time. I was never a member of JACL. He said that many of the, excuse me, many of the members at that time were older, and they were focused more on social events, rather than on issues. Especially as discrimination and such at that time. He, as I understand it, he formed the speaker's bureau and he focused on trying to help overcome the alien land laws that that accomplishment didn't happen while he was with JACL. But it was something that he focused on. He continued to have communication with JACL over the years and the work that he did, and to share the issues and how JACL might be involved with some of those issues.

CN: So, Bill, you're muted.

LH: Sorry.

BT: I keep forgetting. Because of the dogs, I muted myself. [Laughs] I forgot to mention that from time to time, even though Camila is doing the interview, that I would jump in if I had any questions.

LH: Okay.

BT: And I again, I apologize in case you had put that in the written summary that I haven't read yet, but how did Phil become active with JACL? What made him become active? Was he active during the camp with JACL?

LH: During camp, he was he was just a teenager. And as I understand it, his sister was very annoyed with him because he didn't spend a lot of time with the family. He was always trying to run off and be with his friends. But they didn't have a lot of activities that they could participate in at camp, and so they mainly played cards. And they went to the, to the laundry room because it was a little warmer there because the weather in Idaho could be beastly in the winter, very cold. And so they would go to the laundry room and they'd play cards a lot and they'd try to look for things to do. One of those things, as young boys are inclined to do, they would catch rattlesnakes and remove the rattlers. [Laughs] The sister complained that he never spent time with the family. Part of the problem there, of course, was that the fathers were absent. His father was removed from them, perceived to be a leader in the community. And as Phil observed, there might have been more objection to what was happening to them, had there been the mature leadership available while they were in the camps, or before they got there, but they were all taken away. And so they were left with children, mothers, and in his case, his mother spoke very little English. So it was a struggle for her, and she was very frightened. So he didn't he didn't have the discipline of the father. And as young boys might be inclined to do, would look around for other activities.

They finally got a few balls, I understand, that they could hit in, around the area. But it was it was just a sandlot game that they could play. Sometimes the older members in the county would assist them with trying to have some sports. But it was limited in what they could do. And it took him time after he, excuse me, after he got out of camp to begin to assess what was needed in his life, and what direction to go. He, for a time, stayed in Philadelphia where some of his family had relocated. He drove a two ton truck in... two ton truck when he was in camp, delivering supplies, and different things across the area, as was needed. And he learned mechanics, auto mechanics. So when he was in Philadelphia, he was an auto mechanic for a while. Finally, his brother kind of stuck the fire under him and said, "I think it's time for you to get serious, and to think about what you want to do," and so on.

<End Segment 2> - Copyright © 2020 Seattle Chapter JACL. All Rights Reserved.