<Begin Segment 11>

LT: Well, you eventually decided not to stay in camp. And you and a friend decided to leave. How did that come about, and where did you go?

JH: I don't know how it came about, but we decided to head for New York. And there was a family back in New York that took care of the Japanese people that relocated to New York, and I think their name was Carpenter. And they lived in Brooklyn, New York, and then he found us a place for us to stay and help with the family. They all had kids. And fortunately, he was able to find a family that was right next to, right next to where we were staying. I would stay in one family, and my girlfriend would stay in the family next, but we were right next door to each other, which was nice, then we would do things together.

LT: Who was your girlfriend?

JH: Chieko, we call her Checkers, Arai. She was from Seattle.

LT: Okay, and so you met Checkers in camp.

JH: Uh-huh, camp.

LT: And was there anything special that you and Checkers needed to do in order to leave camp?

JH: I don't remember if we had anything, you know, I don't remember that at all. And I don't even remember leaving camp. [Laughs]

LT: Okay, okay. You were probably part of the work release program.

JH: I'm sure that's what we were.

LT: Because you and Checkers went to school then.

JH: Uh-huh.

LT: Can you talk about the school that you attended, why you attended it, and what it was like?

JH: Well, they told us that we, I mean, we had to be either working back in New York or whatever, you need to do something, so we decided we'd just go to school. Not that, like sewing, it was not one of my favorite subjects. But Checkers didn't mind. But that's what we did, we went to sewing school back in New York, which was a nine-month schooling, then we got our diploma.

LT: So did you make your decision about sewing school once you got to New York?

JH: No, at home.

LT: Okay, you made the decision...

JH: Yeah, in camp.

LT: Okay, and that was part of the leave application process then. Let's talk about that sewing school. What did you do, what did you learn, what did you think about it?

JH: We learned to make our own pattern, and then that was not at first, we learned how to sew little things, and then we learned how to make our own pattern to fit us, and then by the time we got through with school, which was a nine-month course, we were supposed to make a coat. Well, when the school ended, I was not through with my coat, so of course I took it home with me and I was not fond of sewing. My mother finished it. [Laughs] My mother finished the coat for me.

LT: Sounds like that might have been a difficult nine months then.

JH: Yes, it was.

LT: Okay. When you lived with the Robbins family in Brooklyn...

JH: I'm not... we went to Brooklyn to this family that was going to put us in the home with, when we were in Manhattan.

LT: You were in Manhattan.

JH: Uh-huh, where we stayed.

LT: Okay, okay. And so you helped take care of the little girls.

JH: Yeah, and they were twins, two girls.

LT: Okay, and you also met the cook.

JH: Yes, she was a black lady, very good. Her meals were just really... and then we went, she wanted us to come visit her in Harlem, and she told us how to, what subway to get on, and she would meet us. And she did, and she said, "Don't worry, when you get on, it'll be all black people, but just stay natural and don't, you know, you'll be fine." And so we went to the subway and went to her place, and she, after we had, we stayed for a while, and then she walked us down to the subway, and then we got on the subway. It was amazing, they didn't seem to look at us or anything. But then when I was back in New York, after we had gone back to camp, they told us, "You don't ever do that now anymore. It's not like when you were here."

LT: For a young girl who was raised in Hood River in a rural community, who has then been uprooted from your home, living with Japanese Americans, and then moving to New York and living in an urban area, and then going to Harlem during the war, when you were the only Japanese Americans, you really had a lot of different experiences.

JH: Yes, we did. But you know, I don't know, my girlfriend and I, it just didn't seem to bother us like going, getting on the subway and heading to Harlem, which was all black people lived there. And we got on the subway and we just sat, and everyone on that subway at that time was all black people, but they didn't seem to stare at us or anything. So then we got off where we were supposed to, and the lady was there to meet us, too, this black lady, and we had dinner at her place and stayed for a while. And she says, "Well, you better head back to home," and she says, "I'll walk you down to the subway," and we headed home. And it was great; we really enjoyed it.

LT: So you were the only Japanese Americans in Harlem. And people didn't seem to notice or treat you differently.

JH: They sure didn't.

LT: What about on the East Coast? Because the reason that Japanese Americans were placed in camp was because of the war and because of concerns about Japanese Americans living close to the western coast. And so Japanese Americans were moved inland, and then you and your friend Checkers were on the East Coast where there were very few Japanese Americans. What was that like?

JH: We never paid any attention. We didn't realize we were the only Japanese on the subway or only Japanese walking down Fifth Avenue or anything. There were a few, but we never ran into 'em.

LT: Did anyone say anything or do anything?

JH: No, uh-uh. They just left us alone.

LT: And you had no worries.

JH: No, no.

LT: Okay.

<End Segment 11> - Copyright © 2014 Oregon Nikkei Endowment and Densho. All Rights Reserved.