Densho Digital Archive - Jim Tsugawa Interview (denshovh-tjim

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AC: So when did you leave camp?

JT: I would say probably early 1943.

AC: Early '43.

JT: So I only stayed about a year in camp.

AC: You say you had an older brother who sent you skates?

JT: Yeah.

AC: What was he doing?

JT: He was in MSI, MIS, Military Intelligence Service, going through school in Minneapolis, Fort Savage, I think, was the place.

AC: And he sent you some ice skates?

JT: Ice skates, yeah.

AC: Had you ever gone ice skating before?

JT: No, and I learned real fast. I think I was one of the only few that had ice skates, not many kids had ice skates.

AC: Especially that first winter.

JT: Yeah, that first winter.

AC: So when you moved out of camp, moved to Boise and rented this house, all that's a lot of a change. What were you feeling at the time?

JT: I don't remember, but I do remember that I lived in the area of, radius of maybe four blocks, there must have been, gosh, about eight, nine of us kids from fifth grade to around eighth graders. And we played ball together, football, basketball, not basketball, baseball together. And the parents were really nice, and I never, ever felt prejudice. Just one guy, Lefty Reynolds, I remember his name. He said, "Jim, don't come around the house, 'cause Dad doesn't like Japanese." So that's, but the rest of them, god, the mothers just welcomed me in and treated me like a son. And I have fond memories of those people, 'cause they were really nice. And Boise, Idaho, and the city itself, there would be signs that said, "No Japs allowed," barber shop, "No Japs allowed," But otherwise... let me see, there was, I think, another Japanese family, Hasegawas, probably about three or four Japanese families. But I had a good time in Boise, Idaho. There was lots of play time.

AC: What kind of things did you do to play?

JT: We went down on the greens and played tackle football, and in the summertime it would be baseball. And I remember August, we'd go out in the junior high school lawn and lay down and look up at the stars and then there'd be a lot of shooting stars going by in August.

AC: Perseid meteor shower.

JT: Yeah, that's right.

AC: Now you said that in downtown Boise there were lots of signs saying, "No Japs allowed." How did that make you feel?

JT: Just stayed away.

AC: So it was your older sister and your older brother and you, and your mom was in the hospital most of the time.

JT: She was just, right away she was hospitalized, and she died in December, so maybe three months at home.

AC: How was that Christmas, that first Christmas without her? Do you remember how you felt?

JT: No, I don't remember. I don't remember many happy Christmases, you know, tree and everything. I really don't.

AC: So how did... were your older brother and sister working to support you?

JT: Okay, George, so there was George, me, and Helen. George worked as a bellhop at the Waihi Hotel in Boise, Idaho, and then Henry would send money back from the army. He was one of these odd... anyway, he was a gambler, and he'd maybe win some money and he'd send it home. Henry served in the South Pacific as MIS, and New Guinea first, Philippines second, Japan third. And in Manila, he built himself a restaurant out of stolen lumber from the army. And he said, "I'd probably be in the stockade now. I had a whole truckload of stolen lumber, and the MP stopped me, but somehow I talked my way out of it." And he built a restaurant. Can you believe that? And it was called Casa Manyana, and at that time, I think a cup of coffee cost seventy-five cents. He had a menu. And in the back room, Alton, was a gambling, so he'd rake off from there. But he was a go-getter. [Laughs] He liked you or he didn't like you, he was one of those kind of guys. Nice man.

AC: And he was able to do all this while still doing his military obligations, all in the Philippines.

JT: All in the Philippines.

AC: What happened when he was transferred to Japan?

JT: I don't know what happened to that restaurant, he probably sold it.

AC: But he was sending you guys lots of money?

JT: I don't remember, but it seemed like we got along all right.

AC: So your other brother, George, was a bellhop in the hotel.

JT: Yes.

AC: How was, do you remember him saying any stories of what it was like for him to be serving as a bellhop in Boise?

JT: No, he didn't say much. He worked odd hours. So actually, Helen and I just kind of grew up, no supervision, and no, didn't end up in juvenile court or anything. We were, this kid and I, Leroy Webber was his name, he and I played a lot of football together, sandlot football. But he and I were walking along the street one day in Boise, city, and a police car pulled up. Said, "Boys, I want you get in the car," so we had to get in the car. Took us down to the station, questioned us, and said, "Do you know Johnny Copus?" I remember these names. Johnny was an artist, he loved to do oil painting, and then he stole oil paints. So he said, "Do you associate with Johnny much?" and we said, "No." And then he questioned, he said, "Leroy, have you ever taken anything?" Leroy said, "I took a ballpoint pen." And he said, "I want you to pay for that, apologize to that pharmacy that you took it from." And he said, "Jim, did you take anything?" And I said, "I took an extra comic, one comic book and another comic book on a dare, paid my ten cents and walked out." He said, "I want you to go pay for that comic book and apologize to that pharmacist." And I couldn't do it, because he was so nice to us guys. So I wrote a little letter and put my dime in an envelope, left it there. That's all I knew, whatever happened. And from then on, I never crossed the police. Put the fear of God in me.

AC: So that was the only time they ever stopped you and pulled you over, and, "Get in the car, boys."

JT: Yeah, that's the only time. And another time... that's right. They said there was some lady that would, I'm in the fifth, sixth grade, you know, that would, you'd rattle on their fence, and she'd come out and chase you. So that sounded like pretty much fun. So we rattled on her fence and she came chasing us, but the police were there, too. So we got caught, we didn't get taken to the station, but we got taken home. My sister cried, she says, "My god, you're going to be a criminal." [Laughs] That was my last time with the law.

AC: And what did the police say to your sister?

JT: I can't remember what she said, they said, but that was my encounter with the police.