<Begin Segment 33>

RP: Any other stories or remembrances that you, that we haven't mentioned that you would like to share?

HN: You asked that question of that thing there and I couldn't remember any specific stories other than playing golf in camp.

RP: Oh. Well, we haven't heard much about that.

HN: We played golf in camp.

RP: You did?

HN: 'Cause the Hori father, I don't know if you know Mr. and Mrs. Hori or Kaz Hori, Hideo Hori?

RP: Hideo Hori, I've heard of him.

HN: Okay, well, their dad was owner of Horishokai, which is Hori's, like a mercantile store down in downtown L.A. before the war. And they were big time retailers. And so he was one of the... Mr. Hori was one of the few Isseis that played golf. He had the wherewithal and the money to do that. And so when we went to camp in Block 5 and north of Block 6, around that corner there, he laid out a golf course on the sand, and he made sand greens. He mixed the sand with a little oil, made it not as bumpy or sandy or kind of like if you pulled a pipe across it that it would smooth it out enough to putt. So we used to assimilate to think about as a green. Hit golf balls off the sand onto the green. Get a rake with a pipe on it and rake a line to the hole and putt the ball into the hole. And we played golf in camp. Mr. Hori did anyway. I didn't play golf but I just watched. So, that's how the Hori family played golf in camp. And that's the one thing I remember. And every block had their own basketball court that they built. Block 5 had one. We did, I know.

RP: Do you remember any other improvements or recreational equipment that you had in Block 5? A lot of people mentioned gymnastic bars and things like that.

HN: Well, some people in the mail bought weights for gymnastics and lifting and stuff like that to build their bodies up. Like the Suzuki brothers and Seizo Tanibata in our class, he worked out with him. And Haruki Murakami, my '44 class, he worked out on the bars. They both, all had muscular bodies. 'Cause they ordered the weights in the catalog and then it came in the camp and they were lifting weights. I remember that.

RP: Did you order anything from the catalog?

HN: I can't remember. I don't think I had enough money to buy anything. My folks didn't anyway. In fact, Seigo Yoshinaga, which I told you to interview that you did you said... did you interview him? You did not. You guys should get to interview him. He must have more money than me 'cause he bought a very nice glove in camp. And you know, he let me use it. And in fact, he almost gave it to me in camp. So I had a very good glove to play with in camp and it was all due to him. And to this day I remember it and I remind him of it. [Laughs]

RP: I remember hearing a story from another person who used to golf who said there would be kids that would, they would go down into Bairs Creek or wade in Bairs Creek during the summertime to catch the golf balls that, you know...

HN: That came over the greens there?

RP: That came over the greens and popped in the... and then they'd go and retrieve them and sell 'em.

HN: Well that's where the golf course was, right next to... between Block 5 and Bairs Creek.

RP: Bairs Creek, yeah.

HN: Yeah.

RP: Was there any type of a little golf club, I mean, a clubhouse or anything that you remember being built?

HN: No, it's... Mr. Hori was the only one that I know of, and his sons played golf, too.

RP: Uh-huh. So they actually constructed a course, too.

HN: Oh yeah, they constructed the course and the greens. No grass though.

RP: No grass. We interviewed a gentleman yesterday who had some photographs of the golf course and people golfing on it.

HN: On the sand?

RP: Yes.

HN: Yeah. [Laughs]

RP: And maybe some of 'em were Horis. There were some other people.

HN: Maybe some other people were using it too. I'm sure they were, but...

RP: Did you have, I mean, I know financially you couldn't afford it, but would you have played golf if you had the clubs?

HN: I don't know if I would have played golf. I had too many other activities. I was playing baseball, basketball, and football. So...

KP: We also have, in our files, we've got a copy of a Manzanar golf club permit or something like that. It was printed up.

HN: Oh yeah.

KP: Yeah. Probably people who played the course or something like that. It's kind of like a country club permit.

HN: Oh yeah.

RP: It would be interesting to see a little, you know, what do you call 'em? Score card.

HN: Huh, I've never seen that.

RP: It started as, according to the Manzanar Free Press, started as a nine hole course and eventually was expanded to eighteen...

HN: Oh yeah.

RP: Maybe later on. It had an interesting water hazard that's for sure. [Laughs] Well, Henry, thank you so much for giving us your, your perspective on camp and...

HN: Well, thank you.

RP: ...your stories, we really appreciate it.

HN: I enjoyed giving it, whatever good it's gonna do. [Laughs]

RP: It's again, like I say, another one of the ten thousand stories of Manzanar.

HN: There's a lot of 'em, yeah.

RP: That's preserved.

<End Segment 33> - Copyright © 2008 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.