<Begin Segment 11>

KL: Do you remember Tule Lake changing over time as it became a segregation center and as the extra fencing went up?

SK: Uh-huh.

KL: What can you tell us about how that was to watch?

SK: We heard about the certain section that was, those who came in from the other camps, and so we were told that they were the real gung-ho Japanese, pro-Japan group. And then during the height of the war, we were going to Japanese school, and we couldn't speak English. I remember someone coming around and checking that we didn't speak English on the playground, during recess, rather.

KL: Like a staff teacher or someone at the school?

SK: No, I think it was somebody from the headquarters, Japanese school headquarters, and check on that. And we'd go up to do the daily exercise, calisthenics, and again, what you hear and what actually happened was different. Because it was just this one group who would tie the thing around their head and go around, "Wasshoi, wasshoi," we did it because it was part of our school. We got up real early, went out and did our exercises, and then we had to run with the hachimaki, and, "Wasshoi, wasshoi." And another thing that I remember is that before we started exercise, we turned to the east, supposedly Japan, and we'd have to bow. And I remembered the military coming and watching us. See, amazing how much I remember.

KL: Yeah. So that was with other kids from Japanese school who would go do the calisthenics?

SK: Yeah.

KL: And it was pretty much everybody in Japanese school?

SK: Yeah, it was required. And if you were a child with either the American school or Japanese school, you had no choice. One in the afternoon and one in the morning depending on what section of the camp you were in. And went to Sunday school, there were the Buddhist churches and there were the Methodist churches.

KL: Did you go to Japanese school right from the start at Tule Lake, or was that something that started later?

SK: No, that was established later.

KL: And you were attending both schools at the end?

SK: Uh-huh.

KL: Did you think that you were going to Japan?

SK: We weren't sure. We were preparing ourselves for any eventuality.

KL: What did you think about that possibility?

SK: Again, what is... it is what it is, kind of attitude.

KL: Do you remember, there were a couple big... there was a driver who died bringing the truck home? What do you remember about that?

SK: I remember that it happened, but I don't remember specifics because, again, it was not my age, he was older. And so Hiroshi knows more about that. But I do remember the riots.

KL: What can you tell me about that?

SK: The soldiers came through the barracks and inspected the barracks, and one soldier... and I mentioned the closet earlier, that's significant. Because he was nailing and going through the papers, and he came across... my father wasn't there. He came across these papers with Japanese on it. And he looked at my mother, you know, and my mother didn't know English. And so she kept going like this, and they were Buddhist scriptures. So my brother Nobu, who was watching all this, explained to them what they were, and he put 'em away. He didn't confiscate it or anything. So that I remember, and then I remember the fire that burned down that auditorium, what was the interpretive center, I remember that fire. You know, patrolling, I remember that. And I remember dances that the older kids had, and the movies, we saw movies, B-movies for five dollars in the mess hall, for five cents rather, and the A-movies were ten cents at the auditorium.

KL: Did you ever get Japanese movies in Tule Lake? I remember you said you said your mom had really liked seeing those in Placer County.

SK: No, no, it was always American movies, yeah. I remember seeing Going My Way, for example.

KL: There was also the manager of the co-op who was found dead in 1944, in the summer.

SK: I don't remember that.

KL: Do you remember that happening?

SK: No, no. Because it might have been in another co-op, there are several co-ops throughout the camp. And then we did a lot of catalog ordering.

KL: You did, your family did?

SK: Yeah. And I was talking to my sister Shinobu the other day, and I says, "I still do a lot of catalog ordering," and I think it's just from that time.

KL: How did your family deal with their finances? Do know if your family had a bank account, or if they just saved cash?

SK: Saved cash, yeah.

KL: People ask that sometimes, visitors to Manzanar, they wondered how that worked. You mentioned dances that the older kids had. Did you ever get to go?

SK: No, I didn't, because I was so young. But I remember the movies, that was a big deal.

KL: And they were in the mess hall?

SK: They were in the mess hall and we had to sit on the floor. I don't know how often we had those, but we had Bon Odori.

KL: Tell me about Bon Odori in Tule Lake.

SK: We did it... there was one, the ladies' bathroom, and then there was, they set up a basketball court, so we did it in that court.

KL: Would everybody in Tule Lake come to one location?

SK: No, no, it would be individual blocks, as I recall. Nothing like it is now.

KL: Much smaller scale?

SK: Oh, yeah. Bon Odori's a big thing now, and Soji laughs about it because it's a Buddhist festival. But in Los Angeles, Bon Odori is so, so popular that the Christian churches have taken it on and every occasion, they have... but they can't call it Bon Odori, they have to call it... [laughs].

KL: Spring festival or something?

SK: They call it, they had to call it odori, but they can't call it Bon Odori, because it has a religious connotation to it.

KL: What else do you remember about Buddhist community or Buddhist life in Tule Lake?

SK: Just that... and going to church on Sundays.

KL: Do you remember who the leaders were or what the services were like, how did they compare?

SK: They were pretty much like... in fact, a lot of, now people come in and says, "Well, this is like a Presbyterian thing." But a lot of it was adapted for survival, you know what I mean?

<End Segment 11> - Copyright © 2015 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.