<Begin Segment 10>

LP: Did you get a sense of before, either during camp or after, did she have concern about what Tule Lake meant, that you all were there? Because there was this stigma...

MM: I'm sure, I'm sure. Because I think a lot of the people who did come out of camp, that was the first question you always asked, "Which camp did you go to?" That was just a common thing. And a lot of people didn't want to say they went to Tule Lake, whereas I was young enough that I didn't know, I didn't care. But I know the older people didn't want to say. But I think now it's entirely different. I think a lot of it has to do with George Takei talking about his father. He used to talk to his father all the time, and so he would learn everything about camp. And he's related a lot of stories. And we have another volunteer here who also talked about... he wasn't even born at the time of camp, but he used to talk to his father about camp a lot. So they would have firsthand information about... those are the people you should interview, because they used to talk to their fathers all the time. So their thought are in there, how the fathers felt. And I know George to this day feels very strong admiration for Wayne Collins, because Wayne Collins spent years getting citizenship back for his parents. My parents luckily did not renounce, so we didn't have to go through that. But I think a lot of people went through the periods of years, and I think even people who went to Japan had to work on it.

LP: Something that just popped into my head about renunciation and repatriation, a person I interviewed yesterday said they remembered being told rumors that the U.S. had intended to trade people at Tule Lake for Caucasian POWs.

MM: Right, I heard about that.

LP: Was that something you, at the time, heard?

MM: No, I didn't. I mean, I heard about that, too.

KL: I have a question about the time. I wondered if your daily life, or anything about the conditions you witnessed changed as a result of changes, bigger changes like the installation of martial law or your friend's father being murdered who managed the co-op or the canteen. Did those big kind of timeline changes change your daily routine, and if they did, how?

MM: No, not for me. No, not for me at all. I'm sure it did for adults, but I think our parents in general all protected the children, so that's why they didn't tell us anything about it. They were protecting us from all the problems that were present, and I'm sure there so many, and they just wanted us to have a normal life and a normal existence, so they didn't want to talk about it. Which in a way, at this point in life, it's tough, 'cause we don't know. And probably more people than... there were probably twice or three times more people that didn't talk about it than who did, which is sad.

KL: Did they ever give you any kind of safety cautions or anything?

MM: Uh-uh. I don't remember that at all.

KL: How did being Kibei affect your parents' experience at Tule Lake?

MM: I don't think that, I think a lot of the people their friends were all Kibeis. And since they spoke English well, I think they were more English than Kibei, I mean, Japanese. And I don't feel them having pushed Japan down our throats at all, although they wanted us to learn Japanese. And my sister doesn't understand that much, she's too much younger than I am, but I spent more time with my grandmother before the war, so I knew a little bit of Japanese. I could still read and write a little bit, but that was all because of the schools in Tule Lake. So I feel very fortunate to have had that experience, otherwise I never would be able to do that. I can't carry on huge conversations, but I could get the gist of it.

KL: Can I ask one more? When you guys arrived at Tule Lake, what was the reception from your neighbors? Either who were from Rohwer, like you mentioned, or people who were older term Tule Lake?

MM: I think the longer term Tule Lake people were living in another area. Because people that I knew, they came from all over. So we were all in the same shoes, so everybody was friendly. I mean, one of my girlfriends came from Los Angeles, and one came from central Cal. One came, I can't remember where she came from, she may have come from Los Angeles, too. But we all came from different areas. It's not like the other camps where people would all come from one area. So some of them knew each other already. But in our block, they were from all over. So I think we were all in the same shoes.

<End Segment 10> - Copyright © 2014 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.