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KL: I wanted to kind of get a process by which this unit was established and really got up and started, and I've think we've done some of that. But is there anything you wanted to add to that, relative especially to, like, early planning efforts or archaeology, the land swap that happened?

ER: There was a lot of that, some of it I was involved in, some I wasn't. It seemed like Dave Cherry's office coordinated pretty much with WACC and all to get some of those things going, those studies. The one that I was involved in slightly before I left was the buyout of the building down there that the county used for maintenance. And we were to get, what is it, five million or something from Washington to buy out the county, so they built their new maintenance facility there at Independence. And that was neat to see that happen, that we were able to get the money to get them out of that building. And it was a horrible mess, if you saw it, probably not before it was cleaned up, but it was really a mess with all the oil and grease, it was a mess. But that was the kind of thing... and it was great that there was money coming forward to do things like that. But I think it just, I was so pleased to go back for the dedication of the visitor center to see, wow, how that had grown so rapidly from its beginnings there. It's really a first-class park.

KL: It sounds like WACC had a pretty high level of involvement with early Manzanar stuff. We didn't really talk about that, anything you want to say about that?

ER: Yeah. I don't know that I have really much to add, but Jeff Burton is the one who saw the most, and the work that he had done there. And Roger Kelly the archaeologist, he was with the regional office, but is an archaeologist. But some of the names you had on that list of the park people that, really great people to be involved in getting things together and getting the documentation.

KL: One of the things that kind of came out in that first Manzanar Advisory Commission was Jeff studied the "Three Farewells to Manzanar" and the three different groups that had made a big impression on that site, Paiute community and the Orchard community and the Japanese American confined community. And then when Manzanar was established, sort of the thinking, I think, was that this was going to be a representative site for Japanese American confinement story during World War II. Did you have any thoughts about any of those themes or sort of why or how they played out? It's not a very well-worded question, I apologize.

ER: No. It sounds great, and moving in that direction. One thing I think does surprise me a little bit. It seemed like all the talk was about Manzanar in those early years. But now you're getting, I still get the regular reports from, I guess it's Denver. I got one just the other day on all the grant proposals. I mean, boy, Heart Butte is getting all kinds of money.

KL: Heart Mountain?

ER: Heart Mountain, yeah. And I'm amazed at how all these areas are starting to rise in popularity and support. And I guess at one point I thought Manzanar was going to be probably the one out there, but now they're all getting a piece of it, which is great. Different parts of the country, different people.

KL: Anything else that you wanted to say about discussion of the National Park Service's interaction with the Japanese American community, particularly the Manzanar Committee?

ER: No. I thought that the National Park Service was very positive and had good relationships with everybody, and I assume that still continues.

KL: Any guidance for other units like Minidoka or Tule Lake as they move forward in terms of what worked or what didn't in Manzanar's relationship?

ER: Well, I don't know. I don't know what's happening in the other areas, although I see they're getting grant money and doing things. We stopped up at Heart Mountain a couple years ago, but it's just driving in, I don't remember being anything there except the chimney and a couple buildings or so. But I'm trying to, if we get close to some of those sites, I like to swing in and see how it's going.

KL: Yeah, I think that involvement is really important, and from people's comments, it sounds like it was a big part of Manzanar's establishment, and to our minds, still is a very big part of it. So anything that you think helps to foster that, or anything that you saw as a potential hazard to that, probably be good to let those other units, and even us, to go forward with Manzanar, know about.

ER: Well, it seems like the key thing is to get interested stakeholders to help support. It's just like Tule Springs here, that's been, two women got that, three women who got that started more than eight years ago have been working on that ever since. But they were very wise in getting the stakeholders, they got the Air Force to be a stakeholder to support the national monument right on their boundary. They got, whether it's three ex-Park superintendents on that committee: myself, JT Reynolds, and Alan O'Neill. So we're three, and those two have done more than I have because I've been a snowbird and gone six months.

<End Segment 12> - Copyright © 2015 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.