Densho Digital Archive - Richard M. Murakami Interview (denshovh-mrichard

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LP: Do you mind talking a little bit about your brothers, just when they were sent there, they were Kibeis, it sounds like, they were educated there, and just a little bit about what that meant for them to be sent there and their life there and coming back?

RM: See, my brothers... my older brother was twelve years old, he was a Sansei in Japan, because he was Sansei, he was treated as a foreigner, treated differently than a Nisei, a second generation. A Nisei was considered Japanese, a Sansei was considered not Japanese, so he had to go register with the police, he was treated differently. So when people think about a citizen of a country, like even though ethnically you're Japanese in Japan, he's treated completely differently.

LP: What was it like for both of them to be there? It sounds like they were alienated a little bit. Did they have dual citizenship?

RM: No, they didn't lose the citizenship. My father, my older brother had a lot of buddies who kind of stick with him and protected him. My younger brother, who was eight when he went, because they were elementary school, they took all the elementary schools out into the woods. Because the U.S. was bombing Hiroshima, so then that's where they lived. And he said they had to eat plant foods, plant and bugs and things like that. So he had a kind of rougher life. And my brother lived in Hiroshima when he was lucky. The day before they dropped the bomb, he cut his foot. And his class went to Hiroshima to, they would go once a week to clean up Hiroshima. His class went but he couldn't go because he cut his foot. So he was walking to Hiroshima, and when they dropped the bomb, there was a concrete wall, and he was behind the wall. When they dropped the bomb, he was behind the wall, that's why he didn't get any of the effects of the atomic bomb, that's what saved him. So after they dropped the bomb he said he walked home, and all he could see was, it's a whole different story. He told a story here once.

LP: So when they were in Japan when Pearl Harbor was bombed, so did they ever share with you what that meant to them, hearing that news? Were they concerned about the family that was in the States at the time?

RM: All my brother would say was that my grandfather would say, "Why did Japan bomb Pearl Harbor?" He said my grandfather would always say, "Japan is going to lose the war. There is no way they're going to be, to win the war against the United States. So my brothers used to always tell them, "Don't say that," because the Japanese people will get on 'em. But my grandfather was one that said, "No, there's no way Japan could win the war against the U.S. Because, see, my grandfather lived here for I don't know how many years, so he knew the strength of the people here.

LP: So when they came over to this, do you know around when they were getting on that boat to come back to the States? It sounds like it was before you all moved to Florin, or what was the timeline for that?

RM: They came back in about 1946, '47.

LP: Oh, I see, so they were there for the war.

RM: Yeah, they were there for the war. But when they dropped the bomb, we knew they had dropped the bomb, but we didn't know what their fate was. And I really don't know how long it took us before we knew, my mother knew, but I think it was through the Red Cross, but I really don't know what the timeline was on that.

LP: So throughout all of the war, essentially, this part of your family and this other part have very little communication, it sounds like.

RM: None, absolutely none.

LP: Did that weigh on your family a lot, is that something as a kid that you noticed?

RM: Well, you know what, that's something that our parents never talked about, we never talked about it. And this is what I believe. See, when we were put into the camp, people said, "How was life in camp?" I was ten when I went in. As a ten-year-old, I used to play with other kids and all that, and people said, "Did you have fun?" I said, "Yeah, we had fun playing with other kids." And I think that's because of what our parents did. Our parents, even though they suffered, tried to make life as normal as possible for us. So they never really groused or complained about being in camp. So like when my brother was there, never really talked about my brothers, what they may have been suffering. Try to keep our life as positive as possible. So I give credit to our parents. When I say our parents, I mean all the parents. So we tried to keep life as normal as possible. I really truly believe that. Because otherwise they could have said United States, they could have really made it bad for us. They kept us being positive, and I think that's one of the reasons why, after the war when we came back, came back and went to school, college and all that, we were able to succeed, because of the positive influence of our parents, the Nisei and Issei people, parents.

KL: Before we go further, I wondered if you would tell us for the recording the names of both of your parents and your siblings in birth order?

RM: Oh, sure. My father was Kazuo, but he picked up the name Harvey, so it's Kazuo Harvey, and my mother's name was Yomiko. And my oldest brother is named Arthur. We all had English and Japanese names. Some families don't... our oldest brother was Arthur Ichiro, and my younger brother below me was Eugene Toshio, and my sister was Bernice Shizuko, and then Raymond Tetsuo. And then Katherine Hiroko, and then Daniel Shigeo. Is that seven? And I'm Richard Michio.

KL: And you're child number two, right?

RM: I'm number two.

KL: I was curious about why you stayed home. Why did your parents keep you home and send your two brothers, do you know?

RM: Well, I kiddingly tell people, when people ask me that, I tell people, "Well, I knew what was going to happen," people give me a strange look. But, see, I just didn't want to travel, simple. So when they went, I was, in 1941, so I was nine years old. My younger brother was seven, and he wanted to go. Now why a seven year old kid would want to go to Japan, I never asked him. And I don't know if he even knew why, but he wanted to go. And my older brother went, because he was the older son, and you have to understand, my older brother never lived at home with us. He lived with my mother's uncle, who had no kids. That's the Japanese way, I guess, had no kids, so he lived with them. So he was more Japanese than any of us. He did all the martial arts stuff and all that. But I'm a homebody.