<Begin Segment 1>

KL: My name is Kristen Luetkemeier, a park ranger at Manzanar National Historic Site with the Manzanar Oral History Project, and I'm here today in the Fresno home of Marion and Saburo Masada for an oral history interview with Hope Kawashima, who was confined in Topaz and Tule Lake, and we'll be talking about her experiences there, as well as growing up in Loomis beforehand and what her life was like after the family relocated out of Topaz. And before we start talking, Hope, I just want to confirm with you that it is okay with you that we record this conversation and we'll keep it at Manzanar and make it available to the public at their request to watch and listen. Is that okay?

HK: Yes.

KL: Okay. Well, thank you for agreeing to this interview today. And I want to start off, just so people can place you in time and space, if you would just tell us when and where you were born?

HK: I was born on April 2, 1937, in Auburn, California. And my family was living in Loomis, California.

KL: And I know you know something about your, both the grandparents in your family and their immigration experiences, so if you could, I'd like to just start off, if you would introduce us to, maybe starting with your paternal grandparents, their names and what you know about their lives?

HK: I'd be happy to. Actually, my grandfather, Masao Omachi, was born in 1857 and he migrated from Kanazawa, Japan, to Hawaii in 1891.

KL: Do you know what, do you know anything about his family that grew up in, in Kanazawa, or what, how they earned a living or where they went to school or their religious faith, or anything?

HK: Well, actually, I found this out much later, actually when my parents celebrated their 50th anniversary, I found out this information that was translated from a Japanese newspaper, that my grandmother had interviewed a pastor and told her life story, and found out that my grandmother, Tsuneko Ohashi, was born into a samurai family and my grandfather Masao Omachi also was from a samurai family. And they married when my grandmother was only sixteen years old. But then my grandfather, Masao Omachi, had received a stipend (since) the samurais had all received stipends at that time because it was the end of the samurai era, and unluckily -- he used up all their money in no time, by drinking and gambling on geishas and all kinds of other terrible things. And so my grandmother was shocked when he had completely run out of money and tried to sell their son.

KL: Do you know how their marriage was brokered? We'll back up a little bit and ask, do you know how they, had they decided to marry each other, or their families decided?

HK: Well, my grandfather's parents, coming from a samurai family, thought that it would be better for him to marry because he was a playboy. And so they thought if he married he'd settle down, and so they introduced him to my grandmother, who was also from a samurai family. And so it was what you call a pre-arranged marriage, and so I guess this is the reason that maybe he, in some way, (he) was rebelling. And the night of, their wedding (...), my grandmother's maid found her new husband with a geisha, and she of course was shocked, but she didn't know what to do and so she endured. But -- until the time when he tried to sell their son, then she decided that was the last straw, so she went home and then talked to her parents and then she divorced him, which of course was very unusual during that time, (to divorce).

KL: Yeah. Was she from Kanazawa also?

HK: Yes. She was from Kanazawa, and her parents, or her father was considered high ranking, I guess he was (what) they call a fire station person, or a person in charge of watching all the fires, so to speak. And so he was receiving a good salary for his position then. They (served) under Duke Mayeda, I think was the name of the samurai.

KL: I wonder what they thought of her situation.

HK: Well, of course her parents realized that her husband was a playboy and he wasn't going to change. [Laughs] And so they thought it would probably be best for her not to have to keep enduring that.

KL: Do you know how long they were together, at that time?

HK: Well, probably... I don't know, she didn't indicate exactly how long, but it was probably about a couple of years at the most. So she was very young. As I said, she was only sixteen when she married, but then...

KL: What was their son's name?

HK: Kenichi, Kenichi Omachi.

KL: Do you have any sense for who -- you said that his father thought about selling him for more money -- do you have any sense of who, what that meant? Who would've bought him, or what...

HK: No, she didn't say, who he was trying to sell her son to. I think she didn't (say), I guess she was so angry, you know, at that time, or shocked, I think she probably didn't even ask that, or find out about it. But of course she got the son back and took him to her own parents, 'cause she realized that it wasn't a good atmosphere for her son to be raised in. And so then my grandfather then decided to go to Hawaii, and he worked in the pineapple fields in Hawaii, and he was converted to Christianity, I think, well, I think the story was that he was on the ship going to Hawaii and then one of his friends got in a fight, they were in a drunken brawl type of thing, and the, somebody got killed. And so he was shocked because he, then suddenly realized what kind of life he was leading, and then he heard this missionary speaking about, unless he changes, or unless they change they would lead to nothing but death and destruction in their lives. And he realized that was where his life was headed at that time, and so then he decided to become a Christian at that time. So when he went to Hawaii he started attending the Harris Memorial Methodist Church, and then --

KL: What year was that? Do you have any idea?

HK: Well, it was (in) 1891 (when) he went to Hawaii.

KL: That's right, you said that, yeah, 1891.

<End Segment 1> - Copyright © 2014 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.