<Begin Segment 22>

KL: How were you received in the school in Ogden?

MS: Okay, very well. No problem that I encountered there. It was just adjusting to a school that felt a little different than what I was used to, that's about it.

KL: How was it different?

MS: Well, okay, different in what was available in the curriculum. Not the subject that you study, but the other, more gym activities, things like that that was different, which were not available, that has been always available in the California schools. In particular, gymnastics and other... what's the, I can't think of the thing to use.

KL: Like extracurricular?

MS: Extracurricular activities that the schools have in California.

KL: Your sister must have... did she graduate from that school, too?

MS: Yeah, she must have. She had to graduate from Ogden High School to finish up her high school.

KL: What did she do after high school graduation?

MS: Let's see. I don't know whether she went to work or not. For whatever reason, she didn't go to college after that. I'm embarrassed again to say that I don't know what she chose to do.

KL: Did she still live with you?

MS: Oh, yeah. Okay, we were living as a family in Utah.

KL: Did people in Ogden, in your school or wherever, did they demonstrate much awareness of the West Coast situation and the removal?

MS: If they did, they didn't talk about it or question anything about it.

KL: They just pretty much accepted you in and didn't...

MS: Yeah. Or, you know, some of the Japanese Americans who ended up in Ogden and went to the same high school, they were from different areas in California. We didn't discuss anything about the evacuation, we just went on with what was there, the situation there at that time.

KL: Did you guys band together at all, or everybody was just kind of...

MS: Yeah, yeah, we had a certain group that always played together, participated in the same activities.

KL: A Japanese American group?

MS: Yeah, mostly that, right. In that sense it was not mixed, it was kind of what was available to the Japanese Americans as whatever activity that were as simple as basketball teams that you could join and so forth.

KL: Was there a Buddhist church in Ogden?

MS: Ogden, yes, it was. My sister went there. I don't know whether I attended any other services or not. There were also a Buddhist church with an English-speaking minister there, which you didn't see too frequently during those years.

KL: Were there two churches, or was it the same church?

MS: There was, I don't know whether there was more than one Buddhist church, but at least there was one. And, of course, there were many other Christian churches.

KL: Did your mother have a job in Ogden?

MS: I think she did some domestic work, if I'm not mistaken.

KL: Your father's job was in a cannery, you said?

MS: Yeah.

KL: Did it have a connection to the farm? You said he needed to satisfy an obligation to the sponsor. Do you know what the connection was?

MS: It could have been the cannery that the farm was associated with, where they took the produce, the produce that had to be canned, like tomatoes. It could have been.

KL: Do you know the name of the cannery?

MS: I forgot already.

KL: I'm going to ask you all these specifics. [Laughs] It's okay.

MS: All I know is that cannery produced ketchup like Del Monte ketchup, a really good ketchup. I think it was called Pierce ketchup at that time, and it tasted just like Del Monte. Or is it Del Monte that we buy all the time?

KL: That's Pittsburgh, I know. She says Heinz.

MS: Oh, Heinz? Oh, Heinz. I'm sorry, yeah, it's not Del Monte, right, it's Heinz. What am I thinking of? I'm a ketchup person. [Laughs]

KL: Could you judge anything about how he liked that job compared to being a fisherman or being a grocer?

MS: No, he didn't complain too much. It was very typical of him. Even after he had to do gardening, he wasn't complaining about that. I suppose they got used to doing what was available, and they didn't complain much about that. At least I haven't heard him complain.

<End Segment 22> - Copyright © 2013 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.