<Begin Segment 6>

RM: And just to jump back to Washington, D.C. for a moment, do you know specifically what your dad's job duties were after he decided not to go to southern Europe?

SP: I don't know what he did, no. I know he left the job when the war ended. So it must be that because he didn't go abroad, maybe he lost the job, or maybe my mother made such a fuss about being, not wanting to be in the east anymore, that they decided to come back to California. You know, the war was disruptive to all kinds of families, and mine was no exception. And I don't know why it was so hard to go back and pick up where they had left off, whether that even was what they wanted to do, I honestly don't know. I know there was lots of upheaval, there was lots of problems between my parents so that, which eventually led to the divorce, so it was just a really rough time in general for those few years after the war.

RM: They came back to the Owens Valley after Washington, D.C.?

SP: Well, we first came back... we came back to Manzanar so my father could write the reports, and then after that we went down to Southern California in this trailer that we had been traveling with across the country, and interrupted our trip so that he could come back and do those reports. And we were in the Los Angeles area, I went to kindergarten for a few weeks in Burbank, I know, which was not a happy time. And I think my father was looking for work. I don't know it all evolved, but we wound up on the ranch for a year, and I gather that it must not have gone well, because it only lasted a year. And then we wound up going back down to South Pasadena and renting a house there, getting started with life there, and I started second grade there.

RM: When you returned to Manzanar so that your dad could write, I take it, to write the final report, do you have memories of what it was like and where you were at the time?

SP: Well, I just have dim memories of being here, and we have a photograph of me on what I think is my fifth birthday, in front of one of the white buildings I was reading about where the administration lived. So I have dim memories of being in that space sleeping and stuff, but very dim. I don't remember where we ate or what I did all day or how long we were here really. Could have been a hard time, my mother could have been complaining, who knows?

RM: Do you know if your mom was on board with the idea for the ranch in Big Pine?

SP: I think she was, I think she was. But she became disillusioned with it, I think. She used to complain about how hard it was to drive me down to town to play with friends, for instance. I went through a phase where I wanted to learn how to roller skate, and there was only one small square of cement in front of the cold storage barn on the ranch, and it wasn't big enough to roller skate. So I would beg her to drive me down to some tennis courts in town, and she was very annoyed by that. I think it wasn't that far, it's just sort of a reflection of where she was at that time in her life. I don't know a lot about it.

RM: You said you went to first grade in Big Pine?

SP: I did.

RM: Do you remember who your teacher was?

SP: Yes, Ashee Earl, and she was a wonderful person, I loved her. She was a great teacher. She was a family friend also, she was kind of a family friend.

RM: Do you remember any of your classmates in Big Pine?

SP: The name Jimmy Newman comes in, I think he was, I think that was in Big Pine where he was a friend. And we were friends with the people who ran the gas station at the corner of the road that goes up that now looks to be a Shell station. I've been trying all night to dredge up their name. They lived in the house that is still there right next to the gas station, and they had a son who was roughly my era.

RM: Does Nicholas ring a bell?

SP: (Jimmy) Nicholas, yes, yes.

RM: One of the Nicholases lives in Independence now.

SP: Okay.

RM: I don't know his name, the elders that you would have been...

SP: Yeah. And what else do I remember? I remember being enamored of tap dancing during that year and performing in some school play or school talent show or something, and singing the song "Peg of My Heart." [Laughs] Oh, dear.

<End Segment 6> - Copyright © 2013 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.