Densho Digital Archive - Susan Brown Phelps Interview (denshovh-psusan-01-0015)

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KL: Okay, we're back for just a postscript.

SP: Okay, the postscript. I wanted to tell about how my dad was a photographer. He was very interested in taking pictures, and took wonderful pictures, many of which I have. And he was a friend of Ansel Adams, he was very proud of the fact that he was a friend of Ansel Adams. He met him in the 1930s in Yosemite when he and my mother would go in the summertime to work at Camp Curry summer jobs. This must have been when my dad was a schoolteacher. And they met Ansel and they used to pal around together, and I think Ansel taught my father quite a bit about how to take pictures. And I've always felt that the reason Ansel Adams came to Manzanar to take all the picture that he did for his book Free and Equal was because of his connection to my dad, but I don't know for sure.

And I've always been envious of how these people, these men I look back at as being sort of larger than life, all lived together in this area in the '30s and '40s. What a wonderful time it must have been for them to be doing the work they did together. My dad was part of, helped start the Inyo Mono Association which was kind of like the Chamber of Commerce in order to promote Owens Valley as a center for recreation, is the way I think they saw the economy of this area to be developed. And for everyone's benefit, having recreation with hunting and fishing, the nascent skiing industry with Dave McCoy having an interest in putting up a t-bar rope tow.

KL: Were you in the association's office, do you remember?

SP: Once I was in the association's office and I remember the photographs, some photographs that my dad had taken. And one in particular which was a picture of him fishing, fly fishing, in the Owens River in a very scenic place. And I wondered what became of these pictures that just showed the wonderful beauty of this part of the world.

KL: Where was that office located?

SP: It was on Main Street in Bishop, I don't know exactly where.

KL: Do you remember which side or what it was near?

SP: No, I think it was on the, it would be the east side, and I remember there was dark wood paneling in the room that the pictures were mounted on, up high. Great big pictures.

KL: Were your folks in the Sierra Club?

SP: I don't know if they were. I know they knew Dave Brower, though. Dave Brower's name came up a lot.

KL: In what sense?

SP: Just in conversation about... I'm sure they were big promoters of all the things that were going on to protect the environment.

KL: Do you have a feel for what their relationship with Brower was or what they thought of him?

SP: I'm sorry, I really don't. Yeah, I don't. I just know that it was a name that was mentioned in conversation.

KL: Like in the '30s?

SP: In conversation. Can't tell you any more, I'm sorry.

RM: Do you mind if I add one more postscript question?

SP: Fine.

RM: Do you know what your father's relationship was to the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power? I know that the Inyo Mono Association was very involved with them, and I was wondering if you ever heard about that.

SP: Well, I don't remember ever talking to my father about it, but my mother would tell stories about the battle that Owens Valley had with the Department of Water and Power. And from her point of view, what a terrible thing it was, how they came up and stole all the water and so forth. She would tell stories about that. But it's a double edged sword. Sometimes I think it was the best thing that ever happened, because if they hadn't taken all the water, this area would have been developed far more than it is now, and it wouldn't be as beautiful anymore as it is today. But I know that it's... they lived through that, but they didn't live through actual happenings because they came later, but they lived through the results of it and I know it was always a topic of conversation.

AL: I apologize if you already answered this, but when was the last time that your father saw Manzanar? Was he aware of, like, pilgrimages and the growing consciousness, or did you guys already talk about that? His perspective as people... you know, the first public pilgrimage is in 1969, people started coming back, talking about this history, about this site. Do you know if he ever visited or expressed any opinions about the movement to preserve Manzanar?

SP: Well, I'm sure he would have been interested in doing that. He died in (1976), so I had the impression that when he was working with Art Hansen, it was just kind of a topic that was barely, they were just beginning to talk about it. So I can't help but think he would have been really pleased to see that this Historic Site was created and would have loved participating and doing that, providing more information. I'm sure he would have.

AL: Do you know when he last saw it?

SP: Oh, as far as I know, he never came here again after we left in 1946. But he might have come, I didn't know that much about what his life, all the parts of his life for several years. But he was living in Washington state, and I don't think he came to California very much at all after the early 1950s. He was in Washington state and then in Arizona.

AL: I thought he was in Leisure World --

SP: Oh, you're right, yes, of course.

AL: Yeah, I thought he was somewhere in this...

SP: Yes, you're right. When he moved to Leisure World, as far as I know, he never came up here. But he might have and I just didn't know about it.