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AL: So what year did they go from Canada back to Japan?

SO: I think it was about 1933, '33, '34.

AL: So that's about the same time that Japan was expanding, they were at war with China. Do you know how much your father followed sort of the world politics of what was happening to Japan, just the changes in government in Japan?

SO: I can't remember.

AL: Well, that would have been before your time anyway.

SO: Yeah. [Laughs]

AL: You know, some people talk about, well, their parents were very politically attuned, and some people say, oh, no, they weren't paying attention. But he was going back and forth at a time when a lot of things were happening.

SO: Uh-huh, but yeah, he wasn't really into the political scene, I don't think, you know.

AL: What do you think he was like as a young man, what you've heard about him?

SO: I haven't heard too much, actually, because I haven't had any contact with anyone who knew him as a young man.

AL: Do you have any of his writings?

SO: Yes.

AL: As a young man?

SO: No, no.

AL: What about your mother at that time?

SO: She was a typical Japanese wife, she does sort of cater to the family, and always took a second... well, she would say second, she just always did what my father told her to do.

AL: Were there any special obligations that would come from being a daughter of a minister or the wife of a minister, a mother of a minister? Because she had it all around, I mean, in terms of how her role would be different than another Nisei woman.

SO: Well, my mother did a lot at church, you know, she would arrange the flowers, and at one point she was a janitor of the church. But as a daughter of a minister, we would always hear, "Do not bring shame on the family or you'll embarrass your father," you know, you have to have a certain decorum.

AL: So I imagine there would be a lot of pressure. Because I've talked to Nisei friends who were not daughters of ministers, and they still talk about how their parents would say don't bring, is it haji?

SO: Yeah, right.

AL: No haji on the family, so I imagine you have a lot more pressure, because, for the many ties. How would, in that time, how would a minister be supported? I mean, was it something that they would have a salary, or did they just get contributions from their congregation, or both?

SO: No, I read in the papers that when my father was in San Francisco, he was making a hundred dollars a month.

AL: And how would that... was that a good salary at that time?

SO: I'm not sure. I'm not sure whether they had... maybe he lived rent-free in the parsonage, which was right across from the San Francisco Buddhist Church.

AL: So before we get to San Francisco, do you know how long he was in Japan?

SO: Oh, it was not even a year, not even a year. Then he came to Los Angeles, and that's where he stayed for two years, that's how Yoshiko and them met my father.

AL: Okay. So when he went from Canada back to Japan, he went from Canada to Japan and then San Francisco?

SO: No, to Los Angeles, excuse me.

AL: Oh, and then Los Angeles to San Francisco, I see.

SO: To San Francisco, correct.

AL: So he was in Japan just for a little time. Do you know why he didn't bring your brother when he came back?

SO: Because my mother's parents insisted he stay because of his education, because by then he was in elementary school. And I kind of think it's in order to get my father to come back. So my brother always says he was a hostage. [Laughs]

AL: Do you think he felt left behind in Japan?

SO: Yes, yes.

AL: Did he ever talk about his relationship with your grandparents?

SO: I think... well, I think he was spoiled by my grandparents, because I had an aunt, but she was quite a bit older than him, so it was like having three parents. But I think he still resented the fact that he was the only one.

AL: Mas says tell us about -- is there a story?

SO: Well, when they were coming back to America to go to San Francisco, they had to bribe him so that he wouldn't cry so much, so they had to buy him a bicycle and a bunch of bananas. [Laughs]

AL: To stay behind in Japan?

SO: To stay behind in Japan, yeah.

AL: So Mas did not get his bicycle, but your brother did.

SO: No. My brother got his bicycle and bananas.

AL: That's interesting.

<End Segment 3> - Copyright © 2013 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.