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RP: How did your experience at Manzanar shape the rest of your life?

MN: You mean Manzanar? Well, I didn't think it was right, but I felt... you know, some people were very bitter about things, how they were treated and everything, but then too, I thought, well, like my mother says, you make the best of what you can. And so it wasn't fun-fun, not with the weather and everything. Oh my, the weather was something over there, dusty and everything, and cold, hot when it was hot. I'm sure you've experienced all that. But there were people that were complaining, but I thought, well, it's over, so what's there to complain about? I can't do anything about it. It wasn't fair. It wasn't really fair. We had every right not to be put in there, but if everyone else was sent there, well, you got to go with the family.

RP: Did your kids take any interest in your camp experiences?

MN: Well, they've never really said too much until fairly recently. And a lot, I mean, I had a few books on it, but they never really visualized what it was gonna be like, what it was actually like. Yes, we went skiing up there, to Mammoth, but by the time we leave in the middle of the, nighttime, Friday night, and come back, we're so tired we're not -- and they didn't have everything set up then either. We said, "Well, that's where the camp was, you know." But until recently, then all of a sudden they decided, well, they start asking us questions, but Fred has always said to me, he said that he's always, and he says that was the best years of his life, because he didn't have the responsibility of helping support the family. I can see that. I didn't have that responsibility. Of course, there's an age difference too. And he was in camp, same camp, but I never, I didn't do the things he did, but I knew a couple of his sisters. Knew his brother. [Laughs] But I mean, I've never related any... so when I did get to meet his family I thought, "Oh, same brother, same sister." And apparently, well, they wouldn't talk about me, no individual person. And I think maybe too because of the age group, that could be.

RP: So just recently you did visit Manzanar.

MN: Yes, the two, one after another, one week, one week. I think it was in March we went.

RP: Originally Fred wasn't, very reluctant about going up there.

MN: At first he said, "No, I don't want to go." So we thought okay. But I told, they wanted to go and I said, "Sure, I'll go." I was curious to see what it's gonna be like. And when we came back and told him, he wanted to go, so they said, "Okay, let's go next Friday again." [Laughs] And we got up early in the morning so we wouldn't have to drive back at night, 'cause there's no lights or anything in the desert. So he went, and I think he felt a little better too, that he saw. And he says, "I can't visualize without the barracks." I said, "But there's a model there." And he says, "I know, but the actual barracks." And I said, "Well, you're just gonna have to visualize." He, it's hard for him to visualize something that's not there. Like when we were adding onto the house, I could see the blueprints and I could visualize it. He says, "No, I can't see that." I thought, well, everyone's different. But he, I says, "That's where, see," I said, "they're honoring block fourteen," I says. [Laughs] And then he thought, "Oh." And we were telling him about the different plans. "Oh." And he wanted to go, so we took him. He was afraid of a long trip, and I said, "No, don't worry. We'll stop here and there." It was a very, it was, and both times we were very, very lucky. The weather was beautiful, we didn't get a windstorm or anything, it wasn't hot. I mean, it was very pleasant. But thanks to you people, we had a, we enjoyed, the trip was really worth going to, even going up to see the monument.

RP: How did that experience affect your kids, from your point of view?

MN: My point of view? Well, they now realize, Danny, they realize what we went through, and Danny says, "You know, that wasn't fair." He says, it makes him angry, he says, "Look at these people. What can they do?" And I says, "Danny, it's past now." He says, "Well that's not right." And I say, "That's right." It did affect them some. He's learned through, as he grew up, he used to, people used to kind of use him and I said to him, "Danny, you have to speak up." And he said, "Okay, okay." And I said, "Don't you take anything from anyone." I said, "If you're right, you speak up." He finally learned in high school. And now he says, "It's not right." You know, and he's a grown person now. But he's realized, he says, "Well that wasn't right." He said, "Look at these innocent people." And I say, "I know." But he says, "What can you do? When there's an order, there's an order."

<End Segment 20> - Copyright &copy; 2011 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.