<Begin Segment 6>

RP: Let's talk a little bit more about your experience at the segregated grammar school. That was the Florin East School.

DT: Yeah, Florin Grammar School East. We didn't know any better so if it was segregated that was okay. And the teachers were pretty strict but we learned a lot.

RP: And were your teachers Caucasians or Japanese?

DT: They were all Caucasians, very good teachers.

RP: Do you remember any of them in particular?

DT: Yes, Mrs. Kauflin, she was real, real nice, she was an older person and then one night I guess when it was dark, I mean cold in the wintertime, my mom must have put that wine jug and wrapped it in a towel to keep us warm and I got a great big burn here. And so Mrs. Kauflin would change, kind of doctor it up for me and that I remember about her, but she was very nice. And then next teacher was Miss Thomas, I guess Miss Kauflin had first and second grade and Ms. Thomas was third grade. Very, very strict but we learned a lot. We didn't say boo in there, I mean none of the class we spoke back 'cause if they ever sent home a note, we'd get it from our parents. And then my fourth and fifth class was Mrs. Jenkins and then so I guess fifth and sixth I must have gone to... fifth and sixth I must have gone to the segregated school. But I guess it was Mrs. Jackson, I can't remember now but I remembered the first four grades.

RP: Now where was the school that the Caucasians kids, the white kids went to?

DT: It was... our school was west... no, east side of town and the integrated school was on the west side.

RP: How far was the integrated school from your school?

DT: Couldn't be more than five miles. 'Cause there was a railroad and people on the east side of the railroad went to Manzanar or Jerome and people on the west side of the railroad track went to Tule Lake.

RP: So you, like you said, you didn't know any better as far as you never asked your mom why were all Japanese in this class at school?

DT: Mary Tsukamoto I understand was the one who fought to integrate the school.

RP: It was integrated I think in 1939.

DT: Let's see now. Two years before we left so '40, I think around '40.

RP: So she was a strong force in integrating the school?

DT: She was not... no, she was an educated lady but everything, I think she was born with it. Like public speaking, she was really well-known and she was a big force in helping everybody.

RP: What was the difference like having attended segregated school and then going to an integrated grammar school?

DT: I guess they didn't like us but we didn't know any better 'cause there were so many of us. [Laughs] I think there were more Japanese than the Caucasians I don't know. they didn't like us it didn't bother me because we had so many friends I guess we kind of stuck with each other and then eventually everything worked out. 'Cause I'm sure they didn't like us.

RP: Well, yes I know you were still pretty young but you were sort of in the... sort of epicenter of discrimination and hatred towards Japanese.

DT: Yes.

RP: The newspapers, the politicians the exclusion law in the 1924, there was even a reference in Mary's book about your father listening to one of the speeches that was given by the U.S. Secretary of State, William Jennings Bryan, about dealing with the "Japanese problem."

DT: Well, everything was political and in Florin, maybe the young kids, our classmates, didn't like us but their parents were worse. Because some of them have money and they were pretty powerful but some of them didn't have money, they were just as powerful and they didn't want us around. But I didn't know any better.

RP: Do you have any ideas or opinions why there was so much hatred towards Japanese Americans at that time?

DT: Well, the way I understand, there were a lot of farmers, very successful farmers, and they wanted them out. That's all I understood but I think it was all political. They said that they wanted to protect from being... from us fighting with Japan. There wasn't any spy or anything, none of the Japanese Americans did that. We were all for... as far as we were concerned we didn't know any better and we were Americans. And being kind of young, I just didn't even think about it, and when we went in camp I didn't even think anything of it because my mom and dad, we were with them so we didn't care. But I'm sure it hurt them because the strawberries, we hadn't even picked, and they were just ripe on the plants and they had to give that up, they had to leave that, they never even picked the strawberries. And the grapes, there was a lot of work and we just had to... we were just lucky that Bob took care of it, otherwise we would have just had to leave it.

<End Segment 6> - Copyright &copy; 2010 Manzanar National Historic Site and Densho. All Rights Reserved.