W: That's it. I have a rough draft, and I think I'll have mine finished today, all right. Just wondered if you were....

B: I didn't figure on getting it developed until tomorrow or possibly Monday.

W: I think we can probably get it through today anyway. As far as we're concerned.

B: The more I get into it, the deeper I get involved and it is so fundamental that I want to put the General on record without appearing to sound like it's sour-grapes. That's a little hard to do.

W: You know frankly, there are some arguments in favor of it. I thought Mr. McCloy made a pretty strong showing. I don't agree with it from our standpoint out here, but I do think he's got some pretty strong grounds. For action.

B: Which ones do you mean?

W: Well, I mean the necessity for disposing of these people...

B: Well, nobody has ever opposed that. The General has never opposed their use in private employment, and that's not the issue. The issue is that the War Department is undertaking to determine their loyalty and to be responsible for that determination. It is going to be a little hard for the War Department to explain why when they were in Assembly Centers, under control, satisfying all the then requirements, that if it is possible to determine loyalty, they didn't do it then. And save 80 million dollars worth of Relocation Centers that were built. That's the fundamental point.

W: Yes, I see.

B: In other words, maybe it should have been done, but it wasn't done. Now they're getting into the relocation business and I think they are leading with their chin. That's the business. It isn't that there's any debate about the desirability of using them for private employment, but there are an awful lot of jobs besides working in a shell-loading plant to be filled.

W: Yes.

B: They don't have to certify them to work in war plants. They are leading with their chins when they do it. That's the fundamental thing. Nobody debates with McCloy about the fact that you can't keep the people pinned up, but that's not Mr. McCloy's or the Secretary of War's business. That's the Director of War Relocation Authority's business. That's where the fundamental difference comes. The War Department is just getting itself out on a limb and sawing off the limb, in doing this.

W: Yes. Yes, I see. Well I think his arguments of course on them were not directed so much to the justification of the War Dept. doing it as to general proposition.

B: Then he's debating whether Harold Ickes should change the policies on Coulee Dam ... I mean it just isn't the War Department's business. The President created another authority to do that. And the desirability of raising a combat team is no ... doesn't have anything to do with it. You don't have to go thru all this rigamaroll to do that. This includes males, females and everybody else. Even beyond draft age. There is no limitation on who is included and it includes everybody born in the United States. It is so utterly silly for the War Department to get into that business.

W: I don't know how in the world they ever decided to get into it.

B: Well the Japs and Mr. Dillon Myer have done very well. They have sold somebody a bill. And one of the difficulties is, as so often when people are terribly busy, they're trouble-shooters. They are not policy makers who look ahead and are willing to follow thru on a long range plan. They have a problem on the desk and they've got to shoot it. So they shoot something, and if it is pushed off the desk today, even though it comes back tomorrow, today's work is well done. That is what happens back there, so often.

W: Yes, I know it. Well I think you are going to have considerable argument if you get it down on paper. I mean the comments.

B: Well, unfortunately it isn't an argument because they've already made up their mind. That is why it is so difficult to get it down without making it look like sour-grapes.

W: That is a little disheartening but then it will put the General on record.

B: It sure will. That is the general tenor of what I'm going to talk about.

W: That's the main purpose. Now for just a minute, going back to this claims situation. I suppose from what you have here that you are fairly familiar now with that claims set-up. You probably didn't work on this yourself, but you read it. You're familiar with it, aren't you?

B: Yes, oh yes.

W: Well I might say that in general we are taking the position, ... we are treating this as an exception in other words, to the general policy of trying to do what apparently the War Department under

what the Judge Advocate's Office wanted to do. That is to take the load of these off the combat outfit.

B: Why can't we do that?

W: I think we can, except that I think there is some difference of opinion right in the staff, as to the desirability of doing it. But I recognize the advisability of your case...

B: Of course all the information's out here.

W: I thought this was an exceptional situation, but I just wondered. I also get the impression that you are treating it as an exceptional situation.

B: Oh yes, very much so.

W: ...Doesn't cross up with this other policy. But I just wanted to get your idea of the other policy too.

B: Oh, I'm all for the other policy and remember very well when I was back there there was the policy, but I think this probably is an exception and it is only so-regarded, because of the fact that all the dope or information is out here and it would be quite a burden for the War Dept. agency to get it together. They'll probably have to refer it out to somebody...

W: I don't think there's any question ... I have no argument with you on this. I think this is the exceptional situation but I ... one thing ... I want to get a little support on it - the general phase is that we're getting claims thru from the Ninth Service Command that haven't been investigation, sent down here signed by _______, they have a different administrative set-up, so they have an Administrative Director. Don't have an Adjutant General any more.

B: They have one but they don't use him for much besides keeping the record.

W: That's right, sort of a bookkeeper. But now maybe it is a matter of way out somewhere in some minor outfit in Western Defense Command. They send to us for action and compliance ... _____________. In other words they are not searching out local Post Commander or somebody here for action, and instead of sending it to their man to do that they are sending it to us and we're going to have to send it say to the So. California Sector. The result will be that when it comes back thru those channels that we adhere to that, that we'll have 2 general court martials _________ jurisdictions,

and each one of them will have a Judge Advocate and each Judge Advocate will have to attach an opinion. Then it will go to the Ninth Service Command who will boss the whole job and their Judge Advocate will have to attach an opinion and it will get to Washington with 3 J.A. opinions. That, to me, in almost ....

B: Sure, I think it is too.

W: That is exactly the way it is going to work if the Ninth Service Command runs it the way they are starting out.

B: Well I think that ought to be stopped. I don't think the General will take it.

W: That is the one fight we've got to make, I think. I'd like to get your view on it.

B: I agree with you and I think that that certainly should be stopped. It is rediculous [ridiculous].

W: It is really rediculous [ridiculous] and it means you see, Colonel, that it would have just exactly the opposite effect. It will mean that we're doing their work for them on these claims, rather than having them do it for us.

B: Exactly. Sure.

W: Thank you very much.

B: All right, fine. You bet.