<Begin Segment 5>

FA: Who, tell me about Jack Nishimoto. What did he look like?

FE: Well, I'll tell you, he looked a little like, his facial features were a little like Yosh Kuromiya. You know, that type of facial features. About the same size, too, I would say. But he was, he was older. He was older than... he was probably, he looked about as old as Yosh does now, maybe because we were younger he looked old.

FA: Did he tell you what he did before the war?

FE: No.

FA: Do you know what he did?

FE: No, I don't. But I understand that he was always in some way connected with the authorities in camp, like at the assembly centers he was, had something to do with the authorities there. And when we went to Heart Mountain, he used to take out groups to different outside jobs and things. So, he's got, he was always on the inside with the authorities. I don't know under what conditions or why, but that's why he probably ended up being an informant for them.

FA: You didn't say this yesterday, but, I mean, how did he, how did he try to befriend you?

FE: Well, he used to, he used to be a great one for making model planes and things, see? And when he gets one ready, "Come, come on over. I've got some planes, model planes." You know, you're young, you're interested in these things and I'd go over there, and see, he used to make some pretty well-built model planes and cars and things. And we never really were socially, you know, interchange but every now and then we'd get together like that. Then sometimes he'd come over and...

FA: Later on, you found out he was, he was spying on you.

FE: No. Not until the trial.

FA: Right, right.

FE: Yeah.

FA: Looking back, I mean, did you think then that was he was spying? Did you suspect then that he was behaving suspiciously, or...

FE: Not really.

FA: Looking around, or...

FE: No, not really.

FA: Looking back now, you don't think that? You can't recall that?

FE: No. Well, maybe he might have come over and just sort of looked like this, but, you know, something everybody would do. I didn't have any reason to suspect him in any way.

FA: So it was a big surprise when you...

FE: That's why when we saw him at the trial, we were wondering, "Gee, what's Jack doing here? He has nothing to do with this case." Boy, we found out soon enough, you know.

FA: At the trial, did he look at you? Make eye contact?

FE: No. No. He didn't make eye contact.

FA: Did you find that interesting?

FE: Yeah. He kept his eyes averted away from us.

FA: Did you try to talk to him at the trial?

FE: I didn't get a chance to.

FA: If you had a chance to talk to him at the trial, what would you have said to him?

FE: Well, I'd have probably asked him why did he get up there and lie like that? We were all surprised. Knowing what I know now, he would have probably said, "Well, you guys were un-American," or something like that. And try to rationalize what he said, you know. And wanted to impress the government that he was really a loyal American.

FA: How do you feel about that? His actions now?

FE: Very, very... what can I say? Very bad. You know, terrible. I think he was a real... sort of Benedict Arnold type, you know. Betrayer.

FA: After the war, what happened to him? After the war.

FE: I have no idea.

FA: Is he still alive?

FE: I... that I don't know either.

FC: Did you see him once after the war, ever?

FE: I saw him once at a record shop, I think. Out towards Beverly... out on the west, I forget, it was Beverly Boulevard or Melrose, one of those places. I went in, and as I was coming out, I saw a couple. He and his wife coming out, and I looked close, and Jack Nishimoto, you know. So I ran after him and I grabbed him and I said, "What... Jack," I said... okay, what did I say? I said, "Why did you lie so much up there? What was your idea?" And he sorta -- [coughs] -- excuse me. Looked down, and he says, "Well, what you guys were doing was wrong, so the government asked me to get up there and testify so I testified." But I said, "You said things up there that never even existed." And he said, "Well, I thought it did," you know. Something... some... I don't remember the exact conversation we had, but I was angry. I was really ready to punch him, but I thought I don't want to end up in jail again, you know. And the guy's liable to sue me. [Laughs] 'Cause his wife was there. So anyway, I think I called him a few choice names, you know, and cussed him out, and then let him go.

FA: In all these years you've been -- recently you've been mentioning his name, you mentioned it yesterday that no one's come up to you, he hasn't written you, he hasn't complained. No one's threatened you, I mean, with libel or slander or...

FE: No.

<End Segment 5> - Copyright © 1993, 2005 Frank Abe and Densho. All Rights Reserved.