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MN: So how did you manage during those days?

KM: Oh yeah, it was quite a chore, quite a chore. And it wasn't only me, there were a whole bunch of others who were in ROTC, so it was nothing unusual for being seasick.

MN: And you know, with all that gambling going on, were there, say, officers or others who would be sort of policing the situation? Or was it like, "You folks just do what you want"?

KM: We were left alone. But presumably there was... see, at that point already we were Company 11. We were broken down into squads, and a squad was usually twelve or thirteen people. So there was a squad leader. So the squad leaders were always, and above the squad leaders you have the staff sergeant or whatever, in ranking. So you had all these ranking people within the same area. Officers were not around, but the sergeants were always with us. So there was a controlled element.

MN: And I was wondering, what did you do with your money, the money that you had earned through your defense work?

KM: Well, I soon learned how to gamble. At that point, I didn't know. But soon enough, on payday, I think we were on pay schedule, I think, close to fifty dollars. Anyway, I don't know the maximum because there were so much deductions. We had bonds, we were buying bonds, we had so much allotment going home. And so the net result was that my memory is that, in my case, the average person, payday came, we receive about twenty dollars for the month, you know, payday. And we had to make do with the twenty dollars. Soon enough, within the groups, in spite of all that, I remember a few of the boys who never got involved with gambling. They were some of my friends who, to this day, I remember, they never did indulge in gambling. But I think maybe, I don't know for what reason, but the majority of the boys did learn how to play poker, basically to pass the time. Basically had nothing else but to... in the evenings, after all the basic training, especially after payday, for the next two or three days, or four days, four or five days, poker was the most prevalent. Because the craps game was too fast. The losers lost their money real fast. So it didn't continue for two or three days except for the big timers, these so-called pros who ended up with most of the money anyway. They had their own particular level of games. The tenderfoots had their own pennyante games, whereas the others played with big money. And so you had two levels of basically gambling within the...

MN: Some other men have mentioned these pros. Were they really like pro gamblers who did it before and after the war?

KM: Oh, yes. And then, because some of the boys were a little older than us, I think I was about twenty-one, twenty-two. But there were those who were twenty-three, twenty-four, a little bit older, who had been working longer than us, were already adults. And there was this group of 1399 boys. These were the boys who were in the army prior to the war, much older than we were. And so they had already been indoctrinated into the army two, three years ahead of us. And in my battery case, I remember that there were three or four of the boys who were always the winners. But these boys were so generous that when we didn't have any money to go to the PX or anything, they would say, "Okay, let's go down to the PX," and they would pay for everything. And if we wanted to go to see a movie, they said, "Okay, let's go," and they'd pay for the whole group that goes. Five or six of us would go and one person with money would pay for everybody. That's how it was. And even going downtown for a pass, they would treat the boys to whatever beer, of course, it would be very limited, but there would be one person who would pay for everybody because he had the money. It was more or less to be expected who had money, always treated the ones who didn't. So we never suffered from want.

MN: And you know, you mentioned something about your paycheck where you'd have all these deductions and allotment home. You could designate a certain amount that would go to your family?

KM: Oh, yeah. A lot of people had bonds, they bought bonds, and we all took out life insurance, that was a big deduction. Yeah, in the end, the average paycheck that we got over the table was, cash was twenty dollars at my recollection. But when you consider that going to the movies was maybe five cents, it can go a long way.

MN: And so you folks are on the ship, you're on the Lurline, and you get to...

KM: Oakland.

MN: Oakland. And then what happened?

KM: Then we got on the train, and we had no idea where we were going, we had absolutely no idea. We were herded around like sheep, and whenever we got on the train, the orders were to pull the shade down to the trains. And we traveled all over the place with the shades down. Except when we came to a stop, like I remember the one town that I remember, the first stop was in Bakersfield, California. I don't know how come I remember it so distinctly, but Bakersfield was the first stop out of Oakland. And then after that, the next stop that I recall was someplace, it was in Ogden, Utah, I think. And partly because we were allowed to then lift the shades. But when we were out in the countryside, it was okay to lift the shades. But whenever we came into any town or any city, we had to close the shades.

MN: What did you think about the shades being required down?

KM: I didn't think anything particularly except that it was a known fact that our movement was to be kept secretive, and we didn't even care about where we were going to go. Not having any say as to where we were going. It was strictly regimentation, you were already in the army, you were fully indoctrinated to the fact that you just followed orders.

<End Segment 6> - Copyright © 2021 Densho. All Rights Reserved.