Densho Digital Archive
Whitworth College - North by Northwest Collection
Title: Ed Tsutakawa - Heidi Tsutakawa Interview
Narrators: Ed and Heidi Tsutakawa
Interviewer: Andrea Dilley
Location:
Date: 2003-2004
Densho ID: denshovh-ted_g-01-0009

<Begin Segment 9>

AD: Heidi, did you consider yourself an American?

HT: Well, see, that's all I knew. And then we got pushed into the camp like that, my mom says, "This is what America is." And she says, "You say you're American. What's so good about it?" So we always used to fight, my mother and I. Because she's Japan Japanese. And so she said, and I said, "Well, I'm an American. I don't care what you say, I'm an American." And then when this happened, she says, "You're an American, they don't even take care of you. And you still say you're an American?" I said, "That's all I have." That's really all I have. I don't know anything else.

ET: My father did say that, just before he died, he said, "Well, you know, I cannot tell you what to do. You'll have to do what your heart tells you, what you should be doing." In other words, he knew that I would never be able to turn my back against the United States. And that's the way we were, most of us. We only knew the one country. So I think you probably think that the Hawaiian 442 was the thing that I didn't mind going into, combat team, on the front lines with the rest of 'em, because that's the only country I'm going to defend at the time, no matter how badly we were treated. And my father knew about it, he said, "You have to do what you have to do."

AD: But you were with Military Intelligence, right?

ET: Well, I was Military Intelligence in civilian way. I was too underage to be in that spot where they send me, immediately the answer was if they want to keep me, I have to give up my commission, which was okay with me.

AD: Why did you want to --

HT: You know, it was hard for him because he's got brother over there.

ET: Oh, yeah, that's another thing, too.

HT: And if he went over there, you wouldn't know when you were going to meet him. Because we didn't know where he was. And so here he's with the U.S. and other one is with Japan. He was a citizen but I think gave up his citizenship and became Japanese at the time, is that right?

ET: Well, I think everyone has to.

HT: Yeah, he became a citizen.

ET: Not only my brother, but then there were some Caucasians, Caucasian Americans in Japan who fought against us. So that's a storybook type of a situation where two brothers fought for two different countries.

AD: How did you feel about that?

ET: Bad. I don't want to meet him on the battlefield, but I don't think we ever came to that.

HT: But he was lucky, though, because he had a good, what is that, officer?

ET: He was an officer, but they asked him, said, "How many brothers and sisters you have?" Said, "Two brothers. They're both Americans, and my brother served in the army also." And by then I had a brother-in-law. My sister was married, and he was in the front lines in Japan, in fact. And after the war, he went to see my brother.

HT: Tell him what he said.

ET: Yeah, and my brother told me later, he said, "I could not believe that we lost the war with Joe" -- Joe is my brother-in-law -- says he doesn't have the guts, or he doesn't have... [laughs].

HT: He said, "You want to go here?" "No, too far to walk." And we're not used to walking here in the United States. Over there, you walk everywhere you go. And so he says, "Let's go here, let's go there." "No, I'm too tired." "I'm too tired." That's what Joe would say. And so my brother-in-law over there, in Japan, he says, "To this day, I can't believe we lost the war." U.S. GIs who are so tired and can't do anything. He says, "I can't believe that we lost the war."

ET: Well, he was joking.

HT: Yeah, of course he's joking, but I couldn't believe it. He cocked his head and then said, "Couldn't believe it, we lost the war to American GIs, and they're all like him."

ET: He was not a real high-ranking officer or anything like that, but he was a Bar Association, he was an attorney and the Bar Association president.

HT: Oh, your brother.

ET: Of Osaka, which is a really big city, it's like Los Angeles. And well-respected guy. But he said, no, that's okay, once or twice a year we get together, and we do. We see each other in Hawaii, or he came over here about a half a dozen times. I go there about almost every year.

HT: What was it like to have one brother that's loyal to a country that's the enemy?

ET: Really... when you stay together, we don't talk about those things at all. I'm pretty sure that he's pretty loyal to his own country, I'm sure. Because his job is, he was a judge also. And I'm real proud of him, really, and I think he's real proud of me as a good public person for the United States.

HT: So when they get together, they're happy to be together.

ET: Oh, yeah. In fact, he's always with me. He's the younger brother, and he's always curious what I'm doing. And we play golf together an awful lot.

HT: But you know when he comes to the United States, he tries to become an American. He helps his wife open the door for her. But the minute his foot hit the Japan soil, he's a Japanese. [Laughs] That's what his wife told me. Door slams in her face, he walks through it, and then it slams in her face, she says. But in the U.S. he's very, very courteous. She says don't believe when he comes through it... minute his foot hits that soil, Japan soil, he's a Japanese. [Laughs] Yeah, it's funny.

<End Segment 9> - Copyright © 2004 Densho. All Rights Reserved.