<Begin Segment 24>

TI: At some point within, at Tule Lake, they started talking about whether or not -- especially U.S. citizens -- whether or not they would renounce their citizenship and go back to Japan. Was that something that your family had talked about or talked about during that time? About going back to Japan?

KM: No, there wasn't any talk about it within the family. But then, of course, they had the hearings, and they would say, the guys that went through it, says, "This is what the hearing was about, this is what I said," and that was it. And it was up to the, to whoever was interviewing you to classify you, which way you were going.

TI: And so can you tell me what it was like for your hearing when you went forward? Like the questions they asked?

KM: The questions... gee, it's so far back, I can't remember that. I don't know what they asked.

TI: But the outcome, after you went through the hearings, what was, what happened to you?

KM: Well, they just told us to go after we had the hearing, yeah. So, and then after that, why, then we got segregated again.

TI: So tell me about that, segregated again. Where were you taken then?

KM: Then they put, I was sent to Santa Fe after that.

TI: Okay, so after the hearing, so they decided to put you in Santa Fe. How about your father or brothers?

KM: Oh, the brothers, the rest of the family was okay. Oh, one of my brothers went there, my dad went to, I went, and, of course, second, yeah, the next brother went. The three of us were sent to different camps again.

TI: Okay, so you went to Santa Fe, and where did your father go?

KM: Father went to Santa Fe.

TI: So your father went to Santa Fe, and your younger brother went...

KM: I think he went to Bismarck.

TI: Did they ever tell you why you were being sent to Santa Fe?

KM: No, they didn't tell us why, they just said, "You go to Santa Fe." Maybe because we were kind of too active in the community.

TI: Did you think of yourself as being outspoken about what was going on, I mean, in the community, did you articulate your thoughts and why you thought this was wrong?

KM: Maybe. Maybe I did, yeah. Of course, there's rumors, so they could have heard about it.

TI: Well, what's your sense? I mean, in the community, do you think there were people who were observing you and others?

KM: I think there was, yeah.

TI: Because I would think just in this, in this hearing, they couldn't tell too much. I mean, you could tell them almost anything, and the questions, and so they, I'm trying to figure out how they got the information to single you, your father and your brother out.

KM: Don't know how.

TI: So when they decided -- after the hearing, and they decided that you needed to go to Santa Fe, how much time was there? Did you have time to talk to your parents?

KM: Oh, yeah, uh-huh. Yeah, there was time. They give you enough time. They were pretty fair about that.

TI: So when you went to Santa Fe, did you go with your father at the same time?

KM: No, uh-uh. The father went first, and then I went later.

TI: And when they took your father, did you know that you were gonna go later, or did you find out after your father left?

KM: You know, it's just like the FBI, they come middle of the night, knock on your door, and get you dressed up and take you away. And that's what happened to my father, yeah.

TI: And the same thing with you, did they do a similar --

KM: No, for us, it was different. They told us to meet at a certain place, and then we met there, and then they took us.

TI: So your father was targeted.

KM: Yeah, I guess he was, maybe he was too active and that's why.

TI: So at this point, so the Santa Fe was classified as a Department of Justice internment camp.

KM: Right, uh-huh.

TI: Technically, U.S. citizens were not supposed to go to these camps.

KM: Yeah.

TI: And so the mechanism would have to be that you and your father would have signed something to renounce your U.S. citizenship?

KM: Yeah, "no-no," yeah.

TI: Well, more than just the "no-no," but something else that said you would be willing to give up your U.S. citizenship.

KM: That was our hearing in Tule Lake when they...

TI: Oh, okay, so that's when that happened. And then they, it sounds like they came and took your father, and then gave you notice that you were also going to go to Santa Fe. So how did you feel about this? Did you think... so here you went from Fresno to Jerome, to a concentration camp, then you were taken to Tule Lake, and now you're being sent to a U.S. Department of --

KM: Santa Fe.

TI: Santa Fe.

KM: Uh-huh.

TI: So what's your thinking right now?

KM: Thinking, "Well, if it's gotta happen, it's gotta happen," that's all. At that time, you didn't know how long the war's gonna last. You just had a second chance, that's all.

TI: And how'd you feel about this? Were you angry about it, were you just, "Shikata ga nai?"

KM: Yeah, it's one of those shikata ga nai things again. So I wasn't angry about it.

<End Segment 24> - Copyright © 2010 Densho and Preserving California's Japantowns. All Rights Reserved.