<Begin Segment 23>

TI: So tell me the differences in terms of the feeling inside camp. Jerome versus Tule Lake, were there differences in terms of maybe more tension inside Tule?

KM: There was more tension in Tule, Tule Lake, yeah.

TI: And describe that. Why was there more tension?

KM: I guess because there was a lot of Kibeis in Tule Lake, too, and they were pushing their pro-Japanese, which turned out to be pretty good. Because they had the exercises in the morning, and it's all done in Japanese. And, well, they got the older people to start doing exercise, too. So I guess that's why we were living so long, all that exercise we did in Tule.

TI: So did you participate in the morning exercises?

KM: Oh, yeah.

TI: So describe that. How early would you have to rise?

KM: We had to be there at six o'clock, because we had to go to work at eight, and of course you had to eat and all that, so probably about an hour. It was actually a drill march, that's what it was. It was all done in Japanese. And some of these kids, the Kibei kids giving the commands, they were, must have been high school kids when they were in, when they first got evacuated. So they were there, and some of those kids were good.

TI: Now, so how did... so initially, when you were in Jerome, you talked about, well, you were, here you are a Sansei, being put into a camp, and how that wasn't right. At Tule, it seemed like it was a little big different. Here you have people that are maybe more pro-Japan.

KM: Oh, yeah, there's a lot of pro-Japan in Tule, yeah.

TI: And so how did you feel about that?

KM: Oh, it didn't bother me. I let them believe what they believe, believe what I believe.

TI: And so did you think you believed, or your beliefs were different than theirs?

KM: I think it was. I think they were more pro-Japan than we were.

TI: And yours were maybe more upset with the U.S. government?

KM: That's what it was, more or less. That they treated us right and left us alone. And being in business, you always think about the profit end of it. I figured during the war, if they left us alone with all the ammunition and all that good stuff we had, we could have made it through the war. But being third generation, being uprooted and being treated like a third-class citizen. "Wow, what's this government doing to us?" But the thinking was different.

TI: When you're doing these exercises, one of the reasons these exercises were formed were to get people and trained, to then eventually go to Japan and fight for Japan. Did you ever hear that as a reason why to participate in these exercises?

KM: No, no, they didn't, they wouldn't emphasize fighting for Japan. But doing that exercise, wow, lot of discipline. God, the instructions in Japanese, "What?" [Laughs] You listen and then you do what, follow the guy in front of you is doing. But it was, a lot of the older people used to come out and watch, because of being a group, six across, maybe ten deep, and all young men. Then the tall one be in the front, and then the back would be the short ones.

TI: Oh, that's interesting. But if you're in the back, then you can't see as well, right? I mean, you have the tall ones in front, and short ones in back.

KM: In back, yeah. You just followed the guy in front of you.

TI: Okay. I guess that makes... yeah, interesting. I've never heard that. I'm trying to think why.

<End Segment 23> - Copyright © 2010 Densho and Preserving California's Japantowns. All Rights Reserved.