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AR: So where was the bulk of your career spent? I know you're recently retired, or fairly recently.

RE: Half of my career was spent in private practice. Of course, I was always so busy I had to have associates. And a lot of them just wanted to go on their own like I did. So in my years, fourteen young people had become optometrists very successfully. They came through my office as patients, so that was something of pride that they want to emulate the things I did. But eventually, one of my ophthalmologist friend who came to practice in our county realized that he wanted to be associated with me of all things. [Laughs] And so we formulated a association, a partnership, where I said it would be great if we could hire Cracker Jack optometrists to do most of the general ophthalmology work and you retain specialists and we can form a group, which we did. So we had at that, in the beginning, about ten optometrists and ophthalmologists working together and it grew to be seventeen. Now it's twenty-eight.

AR: What's it called?

RE: It's called Lakeland Eye Surgeons and Consultants, Inc.

AR: So you're covering everything from diagnostics to giving prescriptions?

RE: Surgeries, everything was done, taking care of five hospitals in the area for eye care, emergency situations, so...

AR: All right.

RE: It was a good deal. We made sure we didn't lose friends, colleagues, made sure patients went back to them, but we provided the kind of care I think the patients expected. The bottom line is top notch patient care that people would appreciate.

AR: Did you have a, you know... and the focus I guess is kind of on Cleveland here, by the time you got back to Cleveland as a young man and started college, did you have the sense that you would be competitive in the job market no matter what field you went into by that point?

RE: I think so. There was always that degree of confidence. I think that even with my brothers, sisters, we always... I guess we grew up being a little competitive, but we always...

AR: But in the sense of, the racial barriers had come down by that point, where you might not have aspired to that?

RE: Well, you know, I recall coming to Oberlin, it was a diverse community of about seven thousand people. If you included the college it came to about nearly ten thousand, but it was such a diverse community with African American population of about 28 percent. And I really wanted that, but back in those times, in 1963, discrimination was there in a way. When I went to a bank to borrow some money, loan for buying professional equipment, I was denied that by all the local banks. So I had to go out of the county to another bank and they provided the money for me at that time. Of course, later they apologized that they, little did they know that somebody who was of color, so to speak, could succeed in the healthcare field.

AR: So they essentially admitted that they'd discriminated against you?

RE: Yes, and that was wonderful to hear. And of course then the medical community looked at me as...

AR: A little oddity?

RE: Oddity, so I was not accepted, but eventually I became the president of this town's medical society to render the care for everybody. And, of course, there was a lot of howling and protest but certainly...

AR: What's the timeframe on this? '60s, '70s?

RE: Back in the '60s... '60s into the early '70s, it was a very interesting time. But, you know, you roll with the punches. You've got to prove what you're capable of doing.

AR: Did, was there a JACL, Japanese American Citizens League chapter in the Cleveland area?

RE: That's right, uh-huh.

AR: And were you involved in it? Did you help to found it?

RE: No, I really didn't get involved in it until about 1980, '80s.

AR: It already existed and well-established before then?

RE: Yeah, but I did spend considerable time with JACL, you know, it was good.

AR: Just a side question. You know, Roger Daniels, who's kind of a real important person in Japanese American Studies, the "Dean of Japanese American Studies," lived in Cleveland or somewhere near, what's the other big C state?

RE: Cincinnati.

AR: Cincinnati is where he was stationed. Do you ever brush elbows with him?

RE: No, but I heard of him, yes. Cincinnati had a pretty good group of JACL members there. Yes, they did. They were considered, they combined with Dayton, another city nearby, Dayton-Cincinnati JACL, so yes, we heard a lot about them. Good success stories.

<End Segment 6> - Copyright © 2008 New Mexico JACL and Densho. All Rights Reserved.