<Begin Segment 18>

BF: Yeah, I think I agree with your assessment, that a lot of it is practical reflection of numbers and being a very small minority group. But I'm, and I'm wondering if we're gonna get smaller as more Japanese Americans marry non-Nikkei?

TM: Also you're getting smaller in terms of percentage, yeah. Raw number might go up, but you're competing at, with more people.

BF: Yes.

TM: So the percentage, for whatever reason, for those reasons, Japanese Americans are not increasing at no greater rate than the general population.

BF: And we're not getting an influx from Japan.

TM: No.

BF: So what do you, when you think about that, do you have -- I mean, your business is connected to the continuation, a lot of the organizations you've given a large part of your life to are part of the Japanese American community. Your kids are Japanese Americans. Do you worry about it? Do you think it's, well, change, change?

TM: Well, when I'm six feet under, I'm not gonna be able to influence that anyway. I think this why it's important, though, to have the next generation think about how relevant and how important this is. I'm thoroughly convinced we shouldn't be so confident, I felt we were formed like Nikkei, Issei Concerns or, to help the Isseis, and I think we did. And we're struggling to help the Niseis, second generation. But the Sansei, I don't pretend to say that I'm going to be able to be in a position or want to influence that. I mean, that's just the next generation's responsibility. And if the foundation is there, great. But I don't think, I don't want to go to any board meetings, and say, "This is the way it's got to be for the third or fourth generation." That's just, it just doesn't make sense for myself, my generation. It's got to be the next generation or somebody close to it that got to, kind of formulate the, provide the leadership for what's right and good and proper for the next generation. That's the way I feel about the store. I'm very proud of what we would have given them. But after that, heck, six-foot under, you're not going to influence it anyway. And you don't want to worry about that. You kind of want to enjoy what you have, stay healthy. And then when your time has come, you just go. Why worry about what it's going to be in the future?

BF: Well, and you're, you're -- a broad-minded person realizes that the future takes care of itself in a lot of ways.

TM: Yeah. And in, I think, I'm confident that the Nikkei community -- and that's a positive things, on some of this --

[Interruption]

BF: I was gonna ask you -- well, this is, this is kind of a touchy subject, but I want to ask, ask you this because your experience, you have your, you have your feet planted in both communities very firmly, in the Nikkei community and in the non-Nikkei community. And that's slightly rare. So I'm going to ask you about a touchy issue having to do with the interracial marriage rate for my generation and younger generations. What impact do you see that having on the community? Have you thought about this?

TM: Not really. I mean, I haven't thought a lot, but I think it gets back to the numbers game. I, you know, even if 50 percent of the so-called outmarriage happens, so you actually double the in -- not influence, oh, yeah, influence, of the Nikkei, then if half of the people stay committed to the Nikkei culture and our awareness, then you have the same amount as if hundred percent married each other.

BF: Right.

TM: So I think I've seen, and I probably have as much as experience as any because we have had customers that have been with us for three, four generations. A lady I remember serving on Main Street will come and say, "This is my granddaughter, would you meet, whoever." And I said, "Wow." So if she says, "Meet my Sally. She loves Japanese food." So -- but then there's probably some parents that are not coming because their Sally is eating non-Japanese food. But the point is, this is the third generation of the, her grandfather is hakujin, and mother's Japanese. But I don't know what her parents -- but her parents, one, the mother is at least part-Japanese. But here she is, her grandmother bringing her because she likes kimchee, not kimchee, but tsukemono and rice. And she's introducing me as, "Wow, I'm bringing you this next generation that just loves, loves Japanese things." But if she represents half, then the net result is about the same as if everybody...

And the other thing I want to say is that I've found some of the non-Japanese parents that, whether it be a male or female, and most likely if it's a non-Japanese mother, they embrace the Japanese culture and bringing them to the Buddhist Church and things like that, seems like that, in a much stronger sense than the Japanese mother, Japanese third or fourth-generation mother, maybe because they, it's osmosis, they just think it's natural or they just don't spend as much time being aware of the Japanese culture. But if you're born to the Japanese culture, you maybe embrace it and you go out of your way to teach it to your children or allow them the opportunity to embrace it. And so -- and I'm not worried in terms of, I mean, the number. The need for the things that I've worked on, nursing home, elderly care, that has a Nikkei slant or Nikkei prominence, it may not increase, but the need will always be there in some degree, even if it diminishes, it's not going to be like everybody marries outside, and no more Japanese cultural needed. That's not going to happen. It just may not grow, but the need will always be there. In fact, I'm convinced that it might incrementally grow, even if half the, our, our children marry outside, the so-called Japanese heritage people.

BF: Why do you think it will still grow?

TM: Well, because the Japanese culture is not a bad culture, and it has some very strong points. And it's a culture that at least you could think you could identify with. And if you read or if you hear about cultures and educations and religion, some people, not all, but some people tend to gravitate to things that are little easier defined. And obviously, Japanese culture is much more definable than Christian culture that comes from Midwest because it's pretty Americanized. It's not distinct.

BF: Right.

TM: And how strong that is, I don't know. But it's amazing, the number of books sold on Japanese cultures and Japanese religion and things like that, if that's any indication. The other thing is, state of Washington, per capita, or per percentage, have more students learning Japanese than any other state --

BF: Really?

TM: -- maybe next to Hawaii. It really even surpasses Hawaii in terms of percentage. There's a lot of reasons. But the wheat farmer in Palouse, some way feels their product is going to Asia, so -- and Japan is a very comfortable language. It's to, compared to some other Chinese or Malaysian or something. So there's a lot of Japanese students in, all across the state. So the awareness of Japanese and the cultural being somewhat accepted is, continues to grow, I think.

<End Segment 18> - Copyright © 1999 Densho. All Rights Reserved.