<Begin Segment 29>

CC: Did you ever... I mean, you kind of talked about your one experience with not racism, but with the "Jap "thing. Over the course of your career in music, did you ever feel, like, either sexism or racism that really affected you?

MM: You know, the era I grew up in, I didn't realize at the time that these were sexist things or racist things. But now that I look back, I realize that I don't think they were doing it in a mean way, it's just that they didn't know that it was sexist or racist either. But I remember this one band leader, we were playing this job, and I'm really a pretty good sight reader. And he says to me, he says something about, I can't remember, being Japanese or, yeah, he said something about never having had any Japanese players, and that I'm really a good sight reader and violinist. And he was like, "Wow," he says, "you're really good for Japanese." It was like, what do you say? I mean, "Yeah, I'm really good." [Laughs] And so that was one thing. And there were things that, in music, you don't know whether it's racist or just not being beautiful enough or being free enough to do some things that an ordinary person wouldn't do because you're out on the road. You know, you can just take it from there. It can be a very dicey thing. But that might have more to do with sexism than racism, because I don't think that racism played too much into things.

But I don't really know, because I wasn't really thinking about that sort of thing until more recently really. In fact, I had no idea. I still don't know to this day whether... well, I asked my friend Pat, who's Black, I said, "Shall I say Black or African American or what?" She said, "Oh, either is fine." So I still don't know, really, what I should say. So now I've decided the problem is what's behind the intent of the word. How do you say the word? Because if you're just confused as to what you're saying, it's not being racist, it's just you don't know what to say. I think she understood that, so I don't know if she said that just to me because I was just confused. [Laughs] Or whether she really didn't care, I don't know.

CC: Well, what about at Seattle Public Schools? Was there ever any issues there?

MM: Oh, yes. Not for me, but I noticed the kids. Okay, people were pretty nice to me except for one principal, which I won't get into, because I was going to take him to court, practically. I mean, this is in Bellevue, and he was one of these old guys with, it was ninety degrees outside, he has on a suit with a tie. I'll tell you about this because it really pissed me off. I mean, as an instrumental music teacher, you go into school, I mean, your itinerary, you don't stay at one school all day long except in Seattle, if you have a big enough enrollment, then you can stay in one school for that one day. But in Bellevue, as I was just a string teacher, I had this one school, and I won't name the school and I won't name the principal, but I went in there and -- as a new teacher. Not new teacher, but new to that school. And they wanted me to teach in this room that had phys ed equipment in there, and I had to move the stuff because they hadn't moved it. And so I went in and complained, and I said, "You know, I have half an hour, I have to set up my music stand and my chairs, I don't have time to do their stuff, they should put their stuff away and put their tables away." And so he said he would take care of it. So that was fine. I mean, I asked nicely. So the next time I come, none of it is done. So I went in there and I said, "You know, it's still out there. Why hasn't it been done? It's taking away from my teaching time, and I'm not here that long." He started yelling at me. He said, "You're lucky you have a place to teach." And I said, "What?" and we started yelling at each other because I couldn't control myself, I was so mad. And I didn't know if he meant because I was Japanese or because I was a music teacher. I mean, I didn't really know, because he was not pro-instrumental music either. But I think it sounded like it was because he's not, I mean, he was a racist. So I started crying, because when I get that emotional and mad, I start crying. So I went over to the general music teacher, because I couldn't go into my room and see that, I didn't want my kids to see that I'd been crying. So she said, "You know, he's got a lot of grievances against him and you should add your thing to it," because she thought it was really awful. So I was going to do that, but then I didn't because he came in and apologized. I guess he realized what a horrible mistake he'd made. So that was my one really racist thing that I pretty much think is racist towards me. I have seen it towards my kids, some of my students.

I know one Black student who was at a school in Ballard, and she wasn't bussed in, she just came to that school, I think. Anyway, she was a really good student, quiet, and there was some problem at the school about somebody stealing something. And at the lunchroom, I'm not there all the time, I mean, I'm only there once a week. So I hear this thing, well, they thought it was this Black student. I'm thinking, no, she's a nice student, she's quiet. And so I was really mad that I can't do anything about it, I mean, I'm just a lowly teacher, right? And I only have her one period per week, half an hour, so I'm not going to have any sway.

And then another time, in a Ballard school, there was one Japanese boy who was a really good clarinet student. He was really nice and he's very, you know, just a really nice kid. And this teacher had him up against the wall, shaking him, and I said, "Just a minute. Are you okay? Do you want me to speak to anybody?" He didn't want me to cause any trouble, because I think he thought these other kids would then make more trouble. But I felt really terrible about that, but I didn't know what to do. I was just too young at that time to know what to do. And I still don't know to this day what I should have done, because I didn't want the kids to beat up on him because he told on them, so that was it.

Oh, and there was one other incident where, actually, I was attacked by, not attacked physically, but these kids were lined up in a row in a Ballard school. Honestly, there were more, at that time, there were more racists over there than anything, I tell you, anyway. So this kid, this boy, he says something to me about, I can't remember all the things he said, but he called me a "Jap" right in front of everybody and his teacher and everything, he was lined up. And I was on my way to one of my classes, I didn't have time to stop and talk to him and say to his teacher, "Are you going to do anything about this?" because I had my class to go to. But it kind of shocked me that a little kid would do that. But I'm sure it was because probably his parents talked that way. Not that all people in Ballard are that, I mean, I've met so many good people there now. They're really some of the most liberal people, I mean, really nice.

CC: I grew up in Ballard.

MM: Yes, I know. [Laughs] But I was really shocked that a little kid would have that nerve to talk to an adult like that. But I think that's all I can remember in terms of racism in the school.

<End Segment 29> - Copyright © 2024 Densho. All Rights Reserved.