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BT: So what happened after you get, you return from that trip?

FS: Well, we came back here, and I worked at the Warner's estate for a while longer. She kept all our stuff. I was... well, what I learned with my dad watching is you get, solve problems, do everything with his hands. So I was able to sort of convert these places to make it habitable for my wife. For example, we had goza. No padding, but goza for the flooring. And I had plywood, I mean, one-by-ten knotty pine that I stained dark so there was bookshelves down low, like everything, down low. We had, these wedding gifts, three chairs. And that was kind of our furniture other than the coffee table was, hollow core doors stained dark, that kind of stuff, mattresses on the floor. So that's how we started out. And then because of my lifestyle, and because we didn't spend a lot of money, and by then Marian was already teaching. We were, you know, we did save a little money and so we started looking for a place. Ended up, they never showed us... the irony of Pasadena, this side of town, like houses of this, wasn't that much more than that side of town, east side. So the realtors never showed us this way, they showed us that way. Or we knew John Carr, of course, you've heard of him. But so we ended up on that side of town after we... and she was teaching and I'm working, so saving a little money. And then knowing that I might have to care for my parents because of the way my mother turned out to be, our first place on East Orange Grove was two houses on a lot. So I guess I was smart enough. We lived in the back little house until Leigh was born, and then we rented the front house. So we managed all that without having big bucks. It worked out. And the original idea of traveling, of course, was more my wife. She was all into traveling and things like that, so we didn't move towards nicer houses as much as just investing in using our money for that type of thing, traveling.

BT: So from this time when you were living in, off of Orange Grove...

FS: Both Orange Groves.

BT: What?

FS: I was at both Orange Groves, south and east.

BT: Both sides, yes, that's right.

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