<Begin Segment 18>

BN: So, yeah, we want to jump ahead a few years and talk about your involvement with the Japanese American National Museum. How did that come about?

FS: Well, it's not that ahead as much as... see, my classmate, Tak (Shida). He was very involved, a very quiet guy, most of my classmates were very quiet Nisei.

BN: This is classmate at USC?

FS: At USC, yeah. In fact, he was... my hakujin partner and various others used to tease him and he didn't make any noise, "What's the matter with your life?" whatever. That's how quiet he was. But he was, always seemed to be involved in J-Town early on, and he knew Bruce Kaji and Colonel Kim, so that's kind of the start of the JANM story. And Tak kind of brought us together, there were about eight of us. And I knew Bruce because of Helen Kawagoe, who worked for Bruce, who was a relative, distant relative of mine. Yes, so I knew Bruce early on, too. And Tak told me what was going on, he was in on some conversation between Bruce and Colonel Kim early on. And so that's sort of how this group of eight architects came to be. And they were not just the young ones, mostly younger, but (George) Shino was part of it, and he was one of the little bit older guys who would have been in... well, I don't know what camp he was in, I don't know that much about him. But he and then his wife was into the arts, and she used to do something that was quite unusual, sell paintings and things to try to "educate" or maybe inspire Japanese Americans her age and things. She went around with my paintings and things, and she used to do that type of thing. So they were a unique couple, and I think the woman recently who did some history on the Japanese Americans before the war. She would have a bigger story about those people, and I think George might be part of that. So that's kind of the JANM thing. Of course, on the JANM site, you're... Nancy, she was involved early with the, who's the whole, your movie people from downtown L.A.? Gosh, I'm terrible. I didn't realize I forgot all those names.

BN: You're talking about Nancy Araki?

FS: Nancy Araki, but she was with the group that was filming early on that did...

BN: Oh, Visual Communications.

FS: Yeah, yeah. See, I kind of knew them more, well, they walked into my office years ago when I was in the Bridge. But I don't know the timing between Tak, because I knew Bruce. So I didn't hesitate to join, but I know a lot of the... and we had one woman, too, and I'm trying to get her recognized more. Because I've never seen JANM talk about these people. And architects don't make a whole lot of money whether you're working for people... you can. I made enough, I had no complaints about the profession or field or whatever you call it. And they gave their time to these workshops and things that Nancy conducted. And I think it's underestimated some of the early input. You know, buildings don't start without money, as I said, and I know that world very well. and JANM didn't have money back then. They had an idea, there was an old church, and Bruce had a space to have workshops, because he was a developer. And it came together, but people gave their own time. It's not easy for a lot of architects to give that kind of time. But it was a commitment that it was of importance at that time. And I keep saying "at that time" because that's how all the excitement, disagreements, whatever, there were a bunch of us that used to meet. And I truly want to make sure that the museum, now that you bring up JANM, that JANM really has a better understanding of those people that gave the time. By then, I've got my practice going, I've got my thing, and so maybe I was doing bigger projects than anybody, but not because I was a big corporate type. So I just had the luck of the draw, you know.

So for me, there's, I won't say anger, but it's disappointment because our field is very little, it's not understood. They were talented, just as talented people with license before the war and right after the war that nobody knows about. And not everybody could be Obata and Yamasaki, but I think it's unfortunate that those voices weren't heard. And in a way, I hope I'm speaking for those people that I really respected. Because anyone going into the field at my time, we didn't look up to Yamasaki or Obata because we couldn't. They're big corporate giants. It's another world. I was looking for people that I could relate to, and fortunately, I did meet a few that worked under the glass ceiling. So I'd rather speak for those people, the Niseis that did their job, had the skill. And even the guy that's ninety-two or -three, we've become good friends. I try to tell him, you know, he did what he could with him, the limits that he had, where he always looked up to me, which I didn't know, right? Because I had my own practice, and I didn't realize I was, he wouldn't even come in the office, and his daughter worked for me during the summer 'til he came to pick her up. And he never went in the office where I was because he thought I was, I had my own place and all that stuff. But, see, there's guys... we didn't have an association, we didn't have all these things, and people like me never wanted to be part of AIA. We knew we didn't belong in that world. So it's a... as it relates to the 9066 history and all that, I think it's unfortunate. Because it's not like doctor, lawyers, dentists. Architects... the symbol is pretty big, right? Because you get the headlines and the rich folks loved to talk about them and take the tours and they'd go all over the world talking about architects. But the reality of the Nisei talent is kind of buried, I think. That's my opinion. Because, see, the writers who write for the response, right? And the audience is people who travel because architecture, unless you have money, you don't travel. You don't come to understand all these reference points. I think I would like to speak for all the guys that paid their dues, and they had to do it the hard way because they had to earn a living to support the family, whatever, if that makes any sense. I'm not speaking for me, I had circumstances that worked for me. But I know it wasn't the same for everyone. It's changed, it's changed a lot. But it's a quirky field. It's sort of fantasy in a lot of ways.

<End Segment 18> - Copyright © 2022 Densho. All Rights Reserved.