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TI: Okay, so let's go to Tule Lake. So, again, kind of a different climate than Fresno. But what were your impressions of Tule Lake when you first got there?

TW: Again it was a dusty dust bowl, and so many barracks, let's see, we were in Block 54. And I remember a big canal that ran between our block and the blocks, 70 or something that was across from the canal, we called it "Alaska." It was just the massive amount of Japanese that were weren't used to.

TI: So it felt like, much larger, much bigger than Pinedale?

TW: Yes, of course.

TI: And with it being larger like that, what other differences did you notice at Tule Lake?

TW: Well, we were educated. We had the English, American schools, and then we also had the Japanese school.

TI: And so at Tule Lake, when you first got there, it was sort of like the other WRA camps like Minidoka?

TW: I think it was the largest, though.

TI: It was, yeah, probably the largest. But then at some point after about, a little less than  a year or so, the government tried to make it into what was called a segregation camp. And I think you were talking about this where others who were maybe planning to go to Japan or just felt that their treatment wasn't appropriate, a lot of them were sent to Tule Lake and then other families were actually moving to other camps. Do you remember that time period? Was that something that created a lot of, or made a difference at Tule Lake?

TW: Well, like I mentioned, my mother being ill at that time, we really had no choice but to stay there. And yet my brother was in the 442nd, in fact, he visited with his army uniform on one time, and nobody seemed to be upset about it. Actually, maybe it was just me, but like Rose Kishi and I, we had a bunch of fun in camp. Like I say, I can't imagine what it was for our parents.

TI: So let's talk a little bit about your mother. You said she was ill, so what type of illness did she have?

TW: She had cancer of the cervix

TI: And did the doctors know right away what she had?

TW: She was diagnosed and they sent her to, I think they sent her to Oregon on a train by herself, and I thought that was terrible that she was going by herself. She was not that ill, even if she had cancer, but she was going there for radiation treatments and then she came back and was hospitalized in Tule Lake, passed away there.

TI: And were you able to visit her very much in the hospital?

TW: Yes. Except I do remember they didn't have enough morphine to really keep her comfortable, and there were times that she didn't get her shot when she was hurting.

TI: Oh, that must have been very difficult for you.

TW: It was. I remember sitting out on the stairs of the hospital crying a lot. It's almost hard to mention. I think the hardest thing for my dad, my mother had requested that he do the after death care for her, and that's what Dad did. Now, I can't imagine how hard and sad it must have been for him.

TI: Do you recall any conversations with your mother during this time period, anything that she told you or said to you?

TW: I don't recall anything.

TI: How about your father? As you were going through this, the family's going through this, you mentioned earlier how your parents were very, I don't want to say protective in terms of saying, "Everything's going to be okay," as this is happening, what's being told to you and your siblings at this point?

TW: I don't think you really had to be told. We were sensing what was going on. Except for sitting out on the stairs, or outside on the stairs crying. And I think my sister Tsuk was two years younger, and Tom was another, quite a bit younger. But I don't think they felt it as much as I did, but it was (sad) that occasion.

TI: And you mentioned Rye visiting Tule Lake. Was it partly because of your mother's, either illness or her death that he visited?

TW: No, he was on a leave and he was able to come, so he... and there was no, the people, they were not upset that he was there or anything, his army uniform. But it was a short visit, if I recall, three days or so he was here, and then he was gone.

TI: While, after your mother passed away, do you recall any service for her? You mentioned your father doing the after death care. Was there like a memorial service or anything?

TW: Yes, I believe there was a service there, right there in our block. I believe they had a service, if I remember correctly.

TI: Thank you for sharing this. Is there anything else that you can remember or want to share about this very difficult time?

TW: You know, you say a difficult time, but really for kids, it was a fun time. Because you lived on the farm, and your families usually just... you didn't have many friends that came over or anything. And here we were with all these other kids. And I met a lot of, like Rose was my best friend there, and now she's here and we're best friend here. So all I recall was having... oh, and one thing I recall, the toilets were in the middle of the block all together, no privacy. And one day I was out late and I came home and I thought they had locked the door on me, well, they hadn't. So I was in the bathroom crying because I thought, oh, they locked the door on me, they're not going to let me in because I was late. Well, they hadn't done that, but I was... and then Mom came out and says, "Come home."

TI: That's a good story. And so any other stories at Tule Lake? You mentioned this, having fun, the taffy, going to Japanese school.

TW: (Yes).

TI: Anything else that comes to mind?

TW: No, not really.

BY: Talk about your grandmother after your mother died. You had said that you became very close to her, and so talk about your grandmother, what your relationship with her was like in Tule Lake.

TW: Yeah. After Mom had passed, of course, Grandma took the place of Mom. She was my father's mother. All grandmothers do is love, right? And I got a big mound of love from her, all of us did. She was a very caring person, hard worker. That's what I remember, mostly.

BY: Do you remember anything in particular that you did with her in Tule Lake?

TW: In camp? Not with her. I know they used to knit a lot, but I never learned how to knit.

TI: Okay.

<End Segment 16> - Copyright © 2022 Densho. All Rights Reserved.