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TI: So you're on this train and you mentioned, from Bellevue, you went to the Pinedale Assembly Center. So what were your first impressions when you got to Pinedale?

TW: When we got to Pinedale, you know, I don't recall a first impression. I think it was dusty, if I remember, seeing the barracks. Other than that, I don't recall much.

TI: How about the weather? Because it's going down, Pinedale is in the Fresno area which is a very different climate than Bellevue, do you remember much about the weather?

TW: I remember it being hot and dusty. You know, it wasn't like Washington.

TI: And, for you, kind of a farm girl from Bellevue, all of a sudden going to the Pinedale Assembly Center. What was that like to see so many Japanese in one place?

TW: Well, of course, we had the Buddhist church in the gathering there. So I was used to Japanese gatherings. But mostly I recall, as a child of eleven, just having a lot of fun.

TI: And so describe that. What were some of the fun things you recalled?

TW: Oh, Rose Kishi, who was also here now, her name was Takeda. In Tule Lake, not at the assembly center, there wasn't anything really provided. But in Tule Lake, we took odori lessons, and we would perform onstage. And like I mentioned, Rose Takeda Kishi, who's here now, she was a very good dancer. So when we performed on stage, Rose played the man's part and I played the woman's part. The man's part is a lot harder to dance, so that was one of the things. Oh, we made taffy, we got syrup from the kitchen. And we would make taffy candy, and when we got the syrup, we would hide out in an empty apartment and boil that syrup up and really pull and pull. And we were very selfish, Rose and I. We had another friend, Kazzie. We didn't want to share our taffy with her, so we wouldn't include her. Wasn't that cruel as a kid? [Laughs]

TI: But it was just the two of you in an empty apartment with, it sounds like, maybe a hotplate or something?

TW: Yeah, we'd go in there.

TI: And you just did it on your own? And what kind of adult supervision, as you start doing things, at either Pinedale or Tule Lake that you recall? Were there a lot of organized activities for you?

TW: Other than the odori dance classes we took, they had, after a while, I didn't go to the American English school, I went to just Japanese classes.

TI: I'm sorry, this is at Tule Lake?

TW: Tule Lake.

TI: Okay, so you stopped going to the American school and just went to the Japanese school?

TW: Yes. So I got, like, a year behind. I was nineteen before I graduated from high school, but my brother kept going. They had names for you if you were... because they had separated people that wanted to stay, go to Japan, go back to Japan, or wanted to stay in the U.S. My mother was ill at the time, we couldn't make a move, so we stayed in Tule Lake. Though we did not desire to go back to Japan... I'm trying to think. So anyhow, they separated the people from pro-America to pro-...

TI: Well, and one of the ways they separated people was they had two different schools, right? They had the American school and then the Japanese school. And my understanding is the Japanese school was more for people who thought they might be going back to Japan. And so how did you end up in the Japanese school when you thought you weren't going to go to Japan?

TW: When we were not going back?

TI: Yeah, you were not planning to go back. It sounded like you weren't planning to go back to Japan.

TW: No, the family was not planning because of Mom being ill. My brother kept on going to...

TI: The American school.

TW: American school. So he did not get behind.

TI: But why did you go to the Japanese school?

TW: I don't know, I guess all my friends were.

TI: So it was more, kind of, almost like your peers were doing that?

TW: (Yes).

TI: Did you feel, any time, pressure, maybe through your friends to go to the Japanese school rather than the American school like your older brother?

TW: I don't think so.

TI: So it was pretty, like you could choose one?

TW: (Yes).

TI: Thank you for sharing that. Going back to Pinedale, before we talk more about Tule Lake, any other memories of Pinedale? You mentioned it was sort of hot and dusty. Anything else that you can recall?

TW: No, I really don't. It's almost, I've never been there, but I know we were there.

<End Segment 15> - Copyright © 2022 Densho. All Rights Reserved.