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TI: Well, about this time, he met your mom. But before we talk about that, let's talk about your mother and her family. So what's your mother's name and where was she from?

HY: Her name was Sumie Yoshida, I mean, Shikuma. Her father was Unosuka Shikuma, who had come to the U.S. at the turn of the century and became a strawberry farmer. Apparently he did quite well. I guess his uncle was here already, another Shikuma family, and together they farmed and became successful and they were able to bring, help other Japanese farms that came on a sharecrop basis. And they grew quite large in terms of farming.

TI: Now, was this the formation of Naturipe or a precursor of that?

HY: A precursor to that. I think it was called West Oak Farms or something, but apparently it was one of the largest strawberry farms at that time. In fact, they were farming near Salinas, I believe, and they had quite a, even a community there where I think they had their own school for Japanese kids. But I think they went bankrupt and they had to start over again.

TI: And before we go there, you just said something that I want ask about, you said they had their own school for Japanese. Did you have a sense that... because I did interviews up in the Delta. And so they also had schools that were for only Japanese, but it wasn't so much because that's what they wanted, it was actually segregation happening, that the Japanese up there could not attend the regular public schools, so they had to form their own school. Do you have a sense of, was that happening down in the Salinas area also?

HY: That may have been. I mean, they were all living in these labor camps, anyway, they were forming their own community and I guess it was easier to stay together in the community than try to go out.

TI: That was a, kind of a bone of contention between the Japanese government and the U.S. Because the Japanese government did not want the Japanese to be segregated, and so that was the, kind of the impetus for the Gentlemen's Agreement of 1908 that the United States agreed to... because they were planning to segregated schools in San Francisco, and so with the Japanese intervention, they stopped that. But in return, Japan agreed to stop sending Japanese immigrant laborers to the United States and Hawaii. So that was kind of, so when you mentioned that, I thought, oh, that's kind of interesting.

HY: Yeah, I hadn't thought of that. I just heard that they...

TI: Yeah, now I'm going to do more research, I'm curious about that. Because I know it happened in the Delta area around Sacramento, I've interviewed people about that. I don't recall the Salinas area, but I'll have to look at that. But you're talking about your grandfather and the success with the strawberries, but I wanted to ask you, before he had his own farm, I think he worked for someone else or worked for people. Do you remember any of that? In particular, the story of, I think you mentioned earlier, Tony Tomasello?

HY: Oh, yeah, that was during the wartime.

TI: But before that, I mean, how he first got to know Tony, wasn't it because he worked for Tony? Do you know anything about that? That he was an Italian immigrant, apple grower, and that the initial connection was your grandfather actually working for Tony?

HY: Yeah, I don't know if he worked for Tony. I don't know if he ever worked for Tony or they worked with him or they just...

TI: Or just like farming friends?

HY: Neighbors or farming friends, yeah. But when they first came over, of course, he must have worked for somebody, because he couldn't own land. But when his, they had a child, first was, we called him Mac, Uncle Mac, was the oldest, and then they could buy land in his name. And then so that's why they were able to start farming on their own.

TI: Well, since you brought up your uncle Mac, so on your mother's side, tell me the siblings of your mother, as much as you can, birth order.

HY: Yeah. Uncle Mac was the oldest, and then there was a...

TI: And his Japanese name was, like, Masasuke?

HY: Masasuke, something like that. And then there was another one that died. I don't know his name, he died probably near childhood. And then there was Kenji, who was the same age as my dad. And then Sumie, which is my mother, and then there was a younger brother, Hiroshi, we called him Heek, H-E-E-K, and he's the one that served in the 442. And then there was a younger sister Emiko, we called her Emi.

TI: You know, there's another name in the government records, I was wondering, Hideko?

HY: That may be the one who died.

TI: Oh, okay. Backing up a little bit with your grandfather, do you know where in Japan his family is from?

HY: Yes. They were not from Hiroshima, they were from... it escapes me right now. [Narr. note: Wakayama Prefecture.]

TI: But southern Honshu, kind of the southern part of...

HY: Yeah.

TI: Good.

<End Segment 6> - Copyright © 2022 Densho. All Rights Reserved.