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PW: Did you see many changes in the Japanese American community or the congregation itself? As, you know, you're moving into the '80s and...

HS: Right, right. I know it's one of the questions that you had mentioned before, but I think that they're more interested. It's interesting that... yeah, interesting thing. I think there's more interest in Buddhism in general right now. And not just in Jodo Shinshu, that's our sect, but in Buddhism in general. To me, (it's) a non-dogmatic religion. And I think that many people who are really thinking people, they don't want to just be told that it's... I shouldn't go against God, but God created you and judges you and all that. And I think in this day and age, it's more difficult to go with that. And so if they're searching for something else, then Buddhism is right there. And so there's more interest even if they don't go to church. They talk about the Middle Way and there's nothing you have to do to be a Buddhist. In fact, (there is a) saying there's 84,000 ways to enlightenment, and going with God (could be considered) one way. But yeah, in this country, I think Tibetan Buddhism is popular, of course, Zen, and Jodo Shinshu and Jodo Shu. I don't know about (other) churches that might be formally (here), but I think there were members or people who ascribed (or) are interested in different Buddhist...

PW: Well, Mountain View as a place totally exploded in population at the time that you have been there as well.

HS: That's true, that's right.

PW: Did that also affect the congregation and the church?

HS: I think it did, but it didn't explode. I don't think it exploded. You were right there, and we were in a very convenient place, but I don't think that we were going out to seek memberships. Our doors (were) always open, so we (would) never would turn anybody away.

PW: Oh, right. No, I meant that in a positive way. I meant that the population... Mountain View as a city grew so much, potentially, right?

HS: That's true, that's true.

PW: So I was wondering if that had effects.

HS: Yes, yes. Because even now, I don't think the membership is huge, you know. I think we're there for anybody who wants to walk in the door.

PW: Is it predominately Japanese American, or is it very mixed?

HS: I would say it's predominately Japanese American. But because there's mostly... or (marriages) outside of the Japanese American community, that it's (becoming) more mixed. But it is kind of interesting (that people are) turned off by religion, but they have other things to do on Sundays. [Laughs] You know, people go golfing or they want to go visit their friends in other towns and things like that. It isn't something people do. It's not something they feel they need (to do). And so I know in Mountain View, I get their newsletter, at least before the pandemic, they used to have gatherings on Thursdays where they would have (...) a social gathering. People would take turns bringing munchies and would learn things like, (...) they would learn (things like) line dancing, I heard. And I think (if there were some people who) knew craft, crocheting, or anything like that, they could learn from each other (...), more than (just) religious study classes. But I think that most churches have at least a study class where they want to go more in depth about the religion itself.

PW: Did Laverne stay at Mountain View for a very long time?

HS: He went to... he was transferred to San Francisco in 1990, I think. So we were very fortunate because from the time that we got (to Mountain View) in 1971 (...) 'til 1990, Rina got to go (...) through all her schooling (while in) Mountain View. From 1990 on, (he was assigned) to San Francisco (Buddhist Church where) he retired (in) year 2000 when he was seventy.

PW: And it was just you and LaVerne moved to San Francisco physically?

HS: We actually commuted from our place in San Bruno, and that's one of the... when you are negotiating with a new church, you could ask for, I mean, that's the time to ask for anything that you might want. And so we said instead of housing there and getting a housing allowance, could you give us the money that you would give us for that to help to pay for our mortgage payments? So it was nice because we were able to come up with a little help from my parents, the down payment for the house in San Bruno, and then we were able to use the (housing allowance from the San Francisco BC). So we ended up owning our home because otherwise we'd be homeless. And I know of ministers who are renting (a place to live after retirement). It's so expensive to live, especially in the Bay Area.

PW: So that was about 1990, when he was transferred to San Francisco, you guys (bought) the house.

HS: Yes, exactly, yes. And he formally retired in 2000.

PW: 2000.

HS: So we were there for ten years.

<End Segment 21> - Copyright © 2022 Densho. All Rights Reserved.