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VY: Did any of your uncles or cousins join the army, join the military?

KI: No, none of them were in the 442nd. But cousins were in the army after the war, and my brother was in the army, too. But this was after the war. So you know, it was a big deal. They would report on how proud we were that the 442nd did so many good things and it supported our sense of pride that, well, we are somebody. You know, I'm old enough to know that the Japanese were in a tough situation, especially for young kids after the war. We faced anti-Japanese feelings and statements and actions. I remember Mike Yurina at Beacon Hill elementary school calling me "Jap."

VY: Who did that?

KI: Oh, Mike Yurina. I'm friends with him today, but he really put me in a bad spot. I can remember that punch he had in my stomach. Oh gosh, it was terrible.

VY: So he actually physically beat you just because you're Japanese.

KI: Oh, yeah.

VY: Do you remember how that started or happened?

KI: Oh, I don't know. But there was a lot of cautiousness. Like I told you the grocery store in the neighborhood said, "No Japs Allowed."

VY: What neighborhood was that?

KI: Beacon Hill.

VY: And this was after the war?

KI: After the war. And then seeing all the war pictures, you know, the newsreels and Japanese soldiers running across the field aflame because they were, flamethrower caught them. And it isn't that I wanted Japan to win, but as a Japanese person, I was a little bit ambivalent about seeing these because, in a manner of speaking, it could be me.

VY: It's a lot of things to hold on to at once.

KI: Well, simple things. Like I went to a dance once and I was late teens, and I asked this white girl for a dance, and she says, if I danced, she said, "You've got to be kidding," as if I crossed the wrong line. So Les' grandfather was right, "Be careful." [Laughs]

VY: You never know how people are going to react to different things.

KI: Oh, yeah. And then, being cautious, you think to yourself, "I better not do this," so you self-censor yourself in a manner of speaking. But at any rate, getting back to being socialized, there was this constant reinforcement of Japanese ethos even though it's within American context. I'll give you an illustration about being mixed. Of course I was interested in airplanes, constantly thinking of them. There was some guy in camp in the latrine, with a pencil he drew a perfect picture of a B-17, and I mean perfect down to the detail. I was amazed when I saw this picture on the wall.

VY: On the wall in the latrine?

KI: Yeah, in the latrine, the picture of a B-17. For people who don't know what a B-17 is, it was one of the big planes that America produced for the war. Well, interested in the airplanes, I once made an airplane out of little pieces of wood, and then put a string, so you could swing it and it would fly. But for some reason I put what's called a meatball, the Japanese sun, on this plane. And then I thought about it and I thought, gee, I better not show it to other people. But what that represents is being between two sides. "You are Japanese, aren't you?" "Oh, yeah." "Your grandma is from Japan?" "Yeah." "Your father is from Japan?" "Yeah." "They speak Japanese?" "Yeah." "They listen to Japanese music." "Well, where are you in all this?" I don't speak Japanese very well, but these are people I know. So someone said it's like being caught between parents who are divorcing.

VY: Interesting.

KI: My mother is Japanese, my father is American, they're arguing. Well, I know it's more than that. Japan did terrible things, I mean, the war machine, it was awful. But you still have this sense that you were, in a manner of speaking, on both sides. I'll give you an example. There was an acquaintance of mine who was Japanese American, and his, in high school he went to, he shared the locker with another guy. And this other guy was British, but also lived in America. But he never lived in England, he lived in China. And in China he was put in a prison camp. So this friend of mine, this Japanese American, apologized to him for being in a Japanese camp. But then, well, there's a contradiction there. The contradiction is, "Aren't you American?" "But you didn't put people in camp, the Japanese government did. Why are you apologizing?" And it really reflects the bicultural nature of Japanese Americans, at least the early ones. And here I am with the plane with the meatballs. Well, that reflected the sort of, the duality. Even though, if I were of age, draft age, I would have gone and fought.

VY: Again, there are so many contradictions, so many things to hold on to at the same time.

KI: Yeah. So I would put it this way. Being Japanese American during World War II was tough. [Laughs] And as a child, I could sense it.

VY: Yeah.

<End Segment 12> - Copyright © 2022 Densho. All Rights Reserved.