<Begin Segment 20>

TI: So after you graduated, any memories or stories about Boise State that stand out that you want to share?

TH: No, I enjoyed it. I joined the journalism club or whatever they called it, different things, joined everything I could, that could have some fun.

TI: That sounds good. So what happened after you graduated from Boise State, then what happened?

TH: [Narr. note: my cap and gown cost $35.] I moved to Seattle.

TI: And this is where your sister was?

TH: Uh-huh.

TI: And why Seattle versus Ontario? Because I'm assuming your parents and your brother are still in Ontario?

TH: Right. And my brother was doing pretty well, he didn't (waste) his education, anyway, but he used it in his business, and he did it pretty well. In fact, he was one of the first Masons, which I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing. Anyway, he and one of the Saitos were invited to join the Masons, so they went to Salt Lake City, and that part, you know, it's all secret, I guess. [Laughs]

TI: Yeah, I don't know much about it.

TH: (...).

TI: But yeah, why Seattle versus Ontario?

TH: Because I thought there was more opportunities in Seattle. Although, at that time, we always had to apologize. You know, there were a lot of ads in the paper. Tons of ads in those days. They're starting to do that again, aren't they, putting ads in the paper? Employment ads or whatever they call it. Anyway, first thing you say is I'm a Japanese, but I'd like to apply for this job or whatever. And they could deny you over the phone rather than you appearing in their office.

TI: So this is something that you did when you would call?

TH: Everybody. Or even, if you want to rent an apartment, if you see it in the paper you'd call and say that I'm Japanese and they'll say, "I don't want you." (...)

TI: Well, going back to that, so when you say that, like, "I'm Japanese and I want an apartment," or, "I'm Japanese and I'm interested in this job," what would the response be if someone, were they direct in saying, "Oh, I don't want to because you're Japanese"? Or would they say something like, "Oh, we don't have that job anymore"? Or what kind of responses would you...

TH: Well, my friend that applied for an apartment on Beacon Hill, hers was, "We don't want any Japs here."

TI: Okay, so they would just say that.

TH: Right. And so, but for me, I didn't have any experience like that, I was lucky. And this Mr. Martine, when I called his company, said, "I apologize. I'm Japanese but I'd like to apply for that job." He says, "I don't care what you are, come on over, I want to hire you." He was the nicest, he was another nice person. He owned all the... he was an attorney, but he owned a lot of NP Bank Note companies that, I don't know how to explain that, but had connections with the banks. But he owned this, all this company. He was a big... his office that I worked in was not big, but it was just an average size, but he was big in the country.

TI: And I'm sorry, what kind of company was it? I mean, it was financial?

TH: He owned NP Bank Note company.

TI: NP Bank Note.

TH: But his company that I applied for was security printing, it was a printing company.

TI: And what type of work did you do with him?

TH: I did the bookkeeping and just general office.

TI: And how many other workers were in the office?

TH: There were seven or eight.

TI: And any other Japanese?

TH: Hiro Hasegawa, which is Bob's -- you know him -- his dad. Yeah, I worked with him a long time.

TI: And he did similar work?

TH: He was a pressman, he did printing. (...). It was (Sat) Hirata. But anyway, there was a couple of Japanese.

TI: So I want to go back when you said that you would notify people that you were Japanese before you got a job or, like, apartment. Do you recall who told you to say that?

TH: We all just automatically did it. Rather than go to the company and have them say, have them tell you, it was easier on the phone. You could just hang up on them.

TI: Oh, okay. So in some ways, it was to avoid that feeling.

TH: Yeah, that hurt.

TI: That you were feeling, okay.

TH: It never happened to me, so it probably would hurt, even to get it on the phone.

TI: I just have to ask this question, just because you mentioned Bob Hasegawa, so I know Bob. So what was his dad like?

TH: Hiro, (nice person, very talented).

TI: Yeah, Hiro. So did Hiro come from camp? Was he like in Minidoka or something?

TH: That I don't know. I just met him at Security Printing Company. Do you ever see Bob?

TI: I do, yeah.

TH: Yeah, tell him that we used to have, not just me, but all the workers. We'd all eat together, bring our lunches, and Hiro would always bring some milk. [Laughs]

TI: Okay, I'll do that.

TH: I worked with him maybe a couple years.

TI: I'm curious, because you knew people who had friends who went to camp, and you worked with people who went to camp. But you didn't have that experience, but yet you easily could have been. Do you see any differences between people who were incarcerated at places like Minidoka versus people who weren't? People who grew up or moved to Eastern Washington?

TH: (...)?

TI: Yeah. Maybe not feelings, but maybe just in their demeanor? Have you seen any changes?

TH: I didn't. I didn't feel any.

<End Segment 20> - Copyright © 2022 Densho. All Rights Reserved.