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TI: Earlier you talked about Washington, it's like brothels, it's where all the brothels are. So it's kind of a seedy part of town.

VI: Yeah, it was. That's why we were there.

TI: Right.

VI: That's why we were restricted to where we could live, and we get the seedy part of town.

TI: So from where you lived, how far did you have to go before you got to the wealthier parts, or the more nice parts of...

VI: Well, what happens is when you went up to Thirteenth Avenue, or Fourteenth, then you got more of the homes. They weren't the mansions and stuff, but they were nice middle-class homes. And then Japanese started moving into that area, and then Collins Playfield was kind of the hub, and people lived all around it. So you had really two areas. Where we lived... three areas. One where we lived, one where Japantown and First Avenue, because all those were leased by the Japanese that had families, and then you had another area which was east of Fourteenth Avenue starting where the Buddhist church is now, where Collins Playfield used to be. And all around there, you had the Japanese starting to move in. Now, if you went further up the hill, then you got into the Jewish community. So you talk about having brothels on Washington Street, they had brothels for the Jewish people up on Twenty-fourth Avenue.

TI: So explain that to me. So they had different brothels for different communities?

VI: I think so.

TI: Because they had two different distinct areas?

VI: I think they had two different clienteles. I mean, at that time, we didn't question that, it was just something of a fact.

TI: So on Twenty-fourth, so right now the main arterial is Twenty-third Avenue. So on Twenty-fourth on the other side of Twenty-fourth? I'm thinking up where the, I think it was the Douglass-Truth Library is, that's an old library on Yesler.

VI: Yesler Library.

TI: Yeah, Yesler Library. So it's kind of in that area, around there, by Garfield High School?

VI: Well, no, it was further south.

TI: Okay.

VI: There weren't too many.

TI: Okay, but I didn't know that. But I know the Jewish community was there because all the synagogues were there and are still there. So the Langston Hughes Center right now was an old synagogue.

VI: Like I think I mentioned to you, on Maynard, that came to an end, then the hill began down to Jackson. So the brothels were all there, so on the corner of Washington and Sixth Avenue... no, Washington and Seventh Avenue, we played baseball. And then home plate would be right in front of the brothels. So a lot of, sometimes you'd see the men coming and they'll sit there and watch us play baseball. So whenever our ball would fall and went on their porch, the madam would come out and take the ball away from us.

TI: Because she didn't want you playing there?

VI: So then we had to quit playing. So after the men kind of spread around, she gave us the ball back. We didn't think nothing of it.

TI: Well, as a boy, what did you think about playing baseball and there was a brothel right there? I mean, what did you think about that? Did you know what a brothel was and what they were doing?

VI: Yeah. [Laughs] But when we were young, I don't think we talked too much about sex, you know.

TI: Right. How about the older boys? Do they kind of do things around the brothels like peek in or stuff like that? Do you have any memories of that?

VI: No, because it was pretty commercial. They had to have a health license or inspection every year.

TI: So back then, was prostitution legalized?

VI: Yeah.

TI: Oh, I didn't know that. I thought they had to pay the police under the table.

VI: I mean, it must have been legal because they're all there, everybody knew they were there. I understand some football teams used to come down, the whole team. Of course, we were a little bit younger.

TI: Well, that area, at least around there, I've heard the term "Profanity Hill." Did you ever hear that term or know about that when you were growing up?

VI: No, because that was the language you heard all around anyway. It wasn't the fine language that you hear of the upper class people.

<End Segment 6> - Copyright © 2022 Densho. All Rights Reserved.