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TI: So, Kaz, we're going to go back and talk a little about the upcoming pilgrimage that's happening at the end of October or early November. And you mentioned earlier about a hundred seventy-five, so of those hundred seventy-five, how many were actually held inside Crystal City?

KN: My guess -- and we don't have an exact count right now, but I would say that are coming, probably about twenty or thirty.

TI: Okay. And then, in addition, of the others, how many of them are family members of the people who were in Crystal City?

KN: I think overall, counting the former internees, about a third of that hundred seventy-five.

TI: Wow.

KN: Eleven from my family is coming, that doesn't even count my wife, my daughter and my granddaughter. But my two sons, wife, girlfriend, my nephew, my other nephew and his wife, so eleven. The Uno family, this is Edison Uno, was very active and known for his work. His nephew is part of the committee, and his family, they're bringing, I don't know, fifteen maybe or more.

TI: Boy, it sounds like maybe even more than a third.

KN: It could be, when you stop and think about it, yeah. Hiroshi's nephew, Brandon, he's half Japanese, half Chinese, he's interested in it. That's really the most important part for me is that even for the committee members, I really would like the younger generation to be part of that committee. And my hope is that when this is, I'm hoping this is going to be fun and successful and informative, and I hope the next generation will carry on for us, simply because, I tell Hiroshi, "Hey, we're getting too old." [Laughs] No, it's important, and to pass on that information, Densho. Such an important part.

TI: So you're hoping that this becomes like a catalyst or a spark for a younger generation to get interested and carry the story forward.

KN: Yeah, especially for Crystal City, the Crystal City camp. The other camps are doing well, meaning there are people that's carrying on, but this is our first official pilgrimage, so it's important that we don't just have younger people in our committee, but the people that attend. Once they get a sense for that, what took place, and I'm hoping my two sons, they were interested right away, which was really good. They got a sense of what I went through, and I think that was important. Hopefully they'll carry on from there, because I wanted to be sure that we have a, even a family website. Meanwhile, I'm so grateful for JANM and Densho to be doing just, this is, I told my granddaughter this morning, taking her to school, when she's my age, she could go into Densho files and see this story.

TI: And see you and her uncles talking about this.

KN: And that's what's important, and she's fourteen. So another fifty-plus years...

TI: Well, tell her don't wait that long. [Laughs]

KN: Yeah, and that's the beauty of what you guys are doing, and I'm so appreciative. Because I don't think anyone's done it as well, that's the key. Everyone's got bits and pieces, but you're now really putting it into, you've done a lot of the Japanese American ones now, but the Japanese Peruvians, Japanese Latin American information. My younger son and his wife went to, I think last year, to the museum in Los Angeles, and they said, wow, they were impressed. That's good to hear that, because I was impressed several years when I went. So it's this kind of thing that I want to be sure it goes on record. Going on record's important because, again, I don't want to lose my family story. Being the youngest in particular, I found that, even though I'm the youngest as we were all growing up, my sisters, my brothers, used to kind of lean on me to be the spokesperson, I'm not sure why. [Laughs] But I was happy to do that as I went along, and now, even more reason why I want to speak for the family because this story is not unique in a sense because there were many other Japanese Peruvian stories that are real similar. But again, it goes back to what my mom and dad went through. It's just... several of my friends that say, "Oh, I heard you're doing these Japanese Peruvian stories, you guys got the worst deal," yeah, because we were kidnapped, of course. The word "kidnapped" wasn't even used way back when, and we used, even in the local, you'll see we don't say "internment," we use "concentration camp," because that's really what it was. So anyways, I'm hoping that this pilgrimage is successful, we get new, good press out of it, I'm having a couple PR people work with me on this, and get it out there that not only was it successful, but that people want to return. I think we'll do this maybe every two or three years, you know?

TI: And how large will the Japanese Peruvian component be, both in terms of the storytelling during the pilgrimage and attendees?

KN: A real important part of it, yeah. The educational part? Definitely. I think that's a big chunk of it, actually. We were at one time thinking, should we include the German Americans and the Italian Americans? Then we decided against that because it was just too much to do, and if you're spending three days and we have German Americans, then half of those three days you want to have people do their thing, and there's just not enough time for that. So we went strictly Japanese Americans, Japanese Peruvians. The Department of Justice camp at Crystal City was really where Japanese came together, that's why Hiroshi Shimizu's family, his dad was interned in three or four camps prior to going to Crystal City. Satsuki's dad, the same thing, different camps, that's where they met. Satsuki's family wasn't even there that long, but overall, in all the camps, they were in there about three or four years, same with Hiroshi's. And what's neat about all this is that we've known each other since the camp. Not real friendly and all that, but immediately after because of the forming of the Boy Scouts, that we got to know each other and we've known each other for over seventy years, which is really a nice story.

<End Segment 7> - Copyright © 2019 Densho. All Rights Reserved.