<Begin Segment 10>

PW: So then when did you meet your future wife, Jean?

HS: Jean... well, anyway, she worked Opa and Deguchi. She was one of Wayne Collins' volunteers, well, they were paid. And it was at her engagement party to, I forgot the Deguchi's name. Anyway, I met her there. I was twenty-seven or something, was getting on, so we got married.

PW: Tell me about who Wayne Collins was. Who was Wayne Collins?

HS: About Wayne Collins? John, can you get me... Wollenberg says that they were volunteers, but I know that Jean was paid, because when I was a resident in radiology, even though I was a fellow receiving three hundred dollars a month, which is more than most people get, she worked 'til the day she delivered our firstborn. So she was paid. She said, "I think I'm going to have a baby today," he said, "Go home." Wayne Collins was, I never saw him smile, but he was a widower, and he had an office, a radiology office, across from a restaurant called the White Horse. He would invite me to have... he was a lonely guy, and he, very tough talker, but a real nice man. [Addressing someone off-camera] The white papers. And I know that all his secretaries were Japanese American.

PW: He was a lawyer, correct?

HS: He's a lawyer, he's a tough guy. And he was telling me all about things, how he's doing. And Jean's brother, what was his name, Jack, was a renunciant, "no-no boys." And so Jean, that's how they got the, besides, the secretaries knew each other anyway, so she'd gone to work there. She was a good typist, she had beautiful handwriting, they taught writing in the schools in those days, I don't think they do anymore. So she did very well, she worked to the last day she had the baby. What was I going to tell you?

PW: Just to clarify, her brother was a renunciant, and Wayne Collins was the lawyer from the ACLU who helped with his case. That's how you think she met him?

HS: Yes.

PW: That's how she met Wayne Collins?

HS: I met Wayne Collins because my wife first was the, one of the secretaries. And he would call me in all the time, he'd take me out, I would talk, he loved to talk, he's a good talker. But you know, he pulled his wallet out, and he says, "I always carry this," and it was an Athenian creed. The creed read, "We believe in Athena, goddess of military views. Protector of our people, destroyer of our foes, defender of truth, justice, and democracy." Here was a man who was a regular Democrat. Well, you know, they tell me this story that I'm sure has been told many times before. He went to Crystal City because he represented lots of renunciants, and he saw these Japanese faces from another compound, and he couldn't understand why they were speaking Spanish. So he went up and talked to them and found out who they were. He was an immediate action guy, he picked up (and called DOJ) and says, "Let me speak to Ennis." He didn't even say, "Mr. Ennis." Ennis was the enemy control officer, and he says, "Ennis, what the hell are the..." he would swear, he says, "What the hell are these guys doing?" And he said he gasped and said, "He's found them."

PW: These are the Japanese Peruvians?

HS: Yeah, he said, "He's found them." You know, it wasn't only Peruvians, the other Latin Americans, too, and even Spanish Japanese. Well, he became our family lawyer, because you run a grocery store nowadays, there are all kinds of litigation, all that. He's a good man to have. And his son took over and became a lawyer, but I don't know much about the store. My brothers worked in Winters for George and Alice Yamamoto, they were childless. When they had to "relocate," they left... when you give the right of acting in your behalf. There's a term for it. Maybe I got it here.

PW: Power of attorney?

HS: Power of attorney, yes. He gave the power of attorney, and this lawyer took everything away from the Yamamotos, because they had no child, and the land was held in the name of my older sister Shizu. So they came for the trial, Collins waited 'til the last minute before, to appear, and he strided into this courtroom with two briefcases full, he had no witnesses. He had records in one briefcase, he's telling me this, and puts another briefcase down, and then the opposing lawyer asks for a, what are they called? Legal terms, talk to the judge. And so he settled. Didn't much, but probably got... and Collins told me that all he had in there were telephone books and law books. He was really imposing, but he's a good man, never smiled.

PW: Explain for this history purpose, what did Wayne Collins do that is so significant for Japanese Americans? Not everybody knows about the cases, the renunciant cases specifically, or Tokyo Rose.

HS: He was Northern Cal, he must have been the chief operating officer, even though he had a private office, he was Northern Cal ACLU, so the ACLU knew about these people all the time. And, of course, the renunciants, Jack actually was sent back to Japan and came back, and died of stomach cancer, bad food. Well, that happens.

PW: He was sent to Japan and then came back and was able to file a case?

HS: To get his citizenship back. All the renunciants got the citizenship back.

PW: And you were describing that there were many Nisei secretaries that worked for...

HS: Yeah, 'cause Wollenberg said that they were all volunteers, they were not. I don't think so. Well, I know that Jean got picked because he was a generous man.

PW: Tell me the name of the secretaries that were working with Jean.

HS: Oh, it's Pat Dobashi, Dobashi, Pat Wada, the Handa girl's name, I don't... you know who has all the lists of that? Japan Historical Society. Because they had the whatever, the ideas to raise money, so she's very good at raising money.

PW: Rosalyn Tonai?

HS: Yeah, Rosalyn Tonai.

PW: And so Jean was already working for Wayne Collins when you first met?

HS: Yes.

<End Segment 10> - Copyright © 2019 Densho. All Rights Reserved.