Densho Digital Repository
Densho Visual History Collection
Title: Ronald Ikejiri Interview
Narrator: Ronald Ikejiri
Interviewer: Tom Ikeda
Location: Los Angeles, California
Date: February 6, 2019
Densho ID: ddr-densho-1000-461-12

[Correct spelling of certain names, words and terms used in this interview have not been verified.]

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TI: And during this time, was there cache being, kind of, the Washington, D.C., representative of the JACL? I mean, you were looking for a job and you found this, did it sort of surprise you what the position meant? I'm just getting a sense of the prominence of the JACL during this time period.

RI: I don't know how people outside of Washington, D.C., look at the JACL Washington position, but I know that when I sat down with the Japanese American delegation, when I sit down with Senator Inouye, certainly with Councilman Mineta, they said, "By default, you represent Japanese Americans," and that's all they had to say. I mean, I know what they wanted to say, there's an add-on to that, like, "Don't mess up, don't do this, don't do something hazukashii." And I think they all conducted themselves in that same way knowing that the outside world looks at you and said, "Oh, okay, you represent Japanese Americans," or, "You represent Asian Americans, you need to do this better." And that was very, very helpful for me. And you know, it's a very Japanese way, most of us would, today, just tell you straight out, "You're not going to do this," "Don't do this." It doesn't work that way. Japanese Americans are very subtle, and it kind of seeps into your mind and it becomes part of your consciousness, and it's one of those things in which you said, "Wow, these people are pretty smart." They didn't have to beat me up, but I beat myself up because I knew I needed to do this better. And along those lines, I did have the, Carl Nobuyuki said, "Okay, you're going to have these five advisors," which was Mike Masaoka, Kaz Oshiki, Pat and Lily Okura, and Cherry Tsutsumida. Then separately, I had my own set of advisors that included Raymond Murakami, a very well-known dentist in D.C., David Nikaido, a patent lawyer, Hideki Yamamoto, who worked at the various aerospace companies, and Frank Sato. And we would get together, actually, we would get together once a week for dinner, and they would make time. And I think they felt sorry for me because I was this twenty-year-old kid, doesn't know what the heck he's doing in Washington, D.C., we need to help him out. I learned so much. They had spent so many hours of time sharing experiences or thoughts, and the official JACL advisor group always told me what not to do. My, the group that I picked, were always telling me that I could do. So there was a difference in approach, both were correct, I just needed to assimilate both of those and make it work.

It was very helpful because by having that, when Japan bashing was pretty big with import cars at that time, and I'd go on NPR or go onto television, we were getting bashed left and right. They were doing things on Saturday Night Live that was about Iacocca smashing a can or something, this is a Japanese car, this is an American car. So I get a call from San Francisco head office saying, "Well, we got to do something about that." So I write a letter to NBC, Saturday Night Live, they said, "Okay, come on up, let's talk about it." And from that emanated a whole series of discussions, and at that time I was able to sit down and talk with Tom Brokaw about how he looks at redress. So through this Japan bashing and how this gets resolved, because at that same time, Vincent...

TI: Chin?

RI: Chin was killed. And the JACL was part of the Leadership Conference on Civil Rights. Douglas Fraser was the United Auto Workers, AFL-CIO, United Auto Workers president. So we brought that issue up to him and said, "Look, we need to tone this down. And it's understandable, and that kind of is important, how you get to be able to at least address the issue. And it's really one of those things where if you get to the right people and explain it, they can quell things down in such a way that it doesn't bubble over and become a problem nationwide or selectively. And to this day, that's one of the things that this, bothered me the most because JACL, people always think about redress, but there were so many civil rights issues that were involved. And a lot of the work that we did, Mike Masaoka and others did in '64, in the Civil Rights Act on the March on Washington, there are pictures of them. Unlike today you just show up with regular old clothes, they all showed up in suits and ties on a hot summer day, walking. And doing that was very important because when redress came up, this whole issue of the Commission on Wartime Relocation, and the JACL, because of Mike Masaoka, JACL was part of the executive committee. And that executive committee would make the decision what issues to support. And redress, there was never a question that they would support the internment of Japanese American, how to right the wrong. And there were two people that were on that, one named Ron Brown. Ron Brown eventually became the Secretary of Commerce, but Ron Brown, at the time I met him, was the Senate Judiciary Committee chief counsel, he was appointed by Ted Kennedy. The other gentleman was the Urban League, his name was Vernon Jordan. And Vernon Jordan, we got along real well, and with Ron, and so if we needed the help, something involved with the Afro American community, or an issue that had broad interest, we would do it. And it was really a time in which those things that were developed -- certainly not by me alone, there were so many people over the years developed that, that when it became the right time for redress, that they were able to come together. I don't think there was any discussion not to do it, the only discussion was how to do it, and when to do the timing.

TI: And so just to make sure I understand, so what you're saying is you walked into the situation where, in many ways, these relationships have been created, in some ways, this base of information, and a network was pretty powerful in place. Who created that? I mean, was it just organic, or was there some thinking ahead of time, whether it's like Mike Masaoka? I'm just trying to get a sense of kind of behind the scenes, because it just doesn't happen, it has to be intentional.

RI: No. If you go backwards and look at it, Mike Masaoka was real key to the JACL, Japanese Americans being involved in the Leadership Conference on Civil Rights. And as you go through this process, it brought labor groups together, it brought church groups together, B'nai B'rith, David Brody. I mean, if I went through the list and saw the letterhead, even I'm kind of surprised. Recently this person, the United Negro Women's president Dorothea Height, H-E-I-G-H-T, she passed away probably about a hundred years old. And I remember every time I'd go to a meeting, she was just so kind, so pleasant to me, and she said, "You know what happened to Japanese Americans should have never happened." But without learning about other people's struggles and other people's things that they had to endure, were disheartening for you, and therefore you're able to take up their cause even stronger. And so much of that was late. I don't think people like Mike Masaoka gets enough credit for doing that. There's a lot of different views in terms of how legislation happens, but I think people have to understand there's probably two things about legislation. One, rule number one of politics is that politicians want to be elected. Rule number two is they want to get reelected. If you can figure those two things out, you can pass anything. Why was there so much resistance to Japanese Americans internment in the years before? If you voted for it, you probably would not get reelected to your office if you're a councilman or senator. Why did they decide that it's important to look at this issue from the standpoint, where is our legal foundation for it? And that's why this whole discussion later, we can talk about it, the creation of the Commission on Wartime Relocation developed.

<End Segment 12> - Copyright © 2019 Densho. All Rights Reserved.