<Begin Segment 25>

SY: You know, I wanted to go back a little to talk a little bit about Fred's family because you have some information about them, about... I didn't get their names exactly.

PM: It's Kokichi Mikuni and Sato Mikuni, and they were educated. Sato, his mother was a schoolteacher, so quite a difference from the Yamato side. And he also came to America and -- the father -- and went to school, so he could read English. So I felt that I was lucky 'cause I was going, I was living with them, but she had understanding because she was a schoolteacher, and therefore I always said I'm not going to yell at her because she really knew a lot and she also had understanding. So it was good for me.

SY: Because really they, you lived with them for --

PM: Yes. I lived with them when I first got married, which is what Dad said not to do, but we had no choice 'cause we didn't have enough money. And so after a while I was able to find a home that we could move them to, so they bought a home close by. They still took care of our kids once in a while. And then after a while, when we moved to Los Angeles, when we left Denver to come to Los Angeles, after a few years I called them because she was always having trouble in the high altitude of Denver and landing in the hospital once a year, so we decided it'd be better if she came to Los Angeles. So she came to live with us in Altadena. It was a quite a difference, because then it was our home that she was coming to. Before, I was going into their home, so it was different, but she was so good to our kids. She had her prejudices, though, so it was good 'cause she always said when Daddy died, "You know, if you have to do, go out or whatever, I'll be here to help you, so don't worry." And she really did, but she never let any people come to the house to visit the kids, especially if they were black. She had her prejudice that way. Then when we went to the grocery store, and in those days they sold tofu in the water and we had to lift it up, and if the meat man or whoever was doing it was a black she didn't want to buy the tofu. So it was interesting. Otherwise they were really nice people. Grandpa always took Joanne to school, and Grandma always took good care of Gary, the older one. It was really nice to have them with me. And she loved to clean house. I like to cook. So it was a good pair. [Laughs]

SY: I'll say. So I'm curious about that, because I know that there was prejudice among Japanese from Japan. You, did you notice that in others besides them? Because it was kind of common, wasn't it?

PM: I think it was, yeah. They had prejudice against Koreans as well 'cause they had some problem -- excuse me -- during the war time.

SY: I see, in Japan.

PM: Yes. So Joanne and Gary couldn't have their black friends come over, although the school they went to, were quite a few negroes, so it was a little hard for them.

SY: I see. They brought it up to you.

PM: Uh-huh. They just weren't allowed in the house, so they played with them at school or wherever they could.

SY: Interesting. So they, then what, they were basically retired when they came to Los Angeles to live with you?

PM: Yes.

SY: And what did Fred's father do when he...

PM: He used to work for a vegetable packing company in Denver.

SY: In Denver, and then when he came here he just, he just stayed with you?

PM: Right.

SY: So you were able to support them with no, with no problem?

PM: Right.

SY: By that time you were, you were solvent enough that you didn't have --

PM: Evidently, yes. [Laughs] To go way back to when we were going to get married, Fred maybe had two thousand dollars in his savings account, so I told Mom, I said, "You know, we're gonna get married, but he only has two thousand dollars." She says, "Money doesn't matter." Do you know that she said that?

SY: Really?

PM: She was very understanding.

SY: I'm shocked. [Laughs]

PM: I know, 'cause she was such a conservative --

SY: Frugal.

PM: Yeah, really. So, but for our wedding we had my friends do the catering. I mean, they made all the sandwiches because my friend's father had a grocery store, so we could buy things very reasonably. So my wedding gown, I remember very distinctly, was a very beautiful one. I paid twenty-five dollars on sale. I had to send it out for cleaning and that cost fifty dollars. [Laughs] It cost to more to have it cleaned.

SY: But you paid for it.

PM: Uh-huh.

SY: And how many people did you have at your wedding?

PM: We must've had about a hundred, our church friends.

SY: Wow.

PM: But it was fine.

SY: Yeah.

PM: We were married for fifty-three years, until he passed away.

<End Segment 25> - Copyright &copy; 2011 Densho. All Rights Reserved.