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SY: So then when your grandfather came here, I'm just curious what... I guess he was considered a community leader here, then?

GN: I think he was. And I also happened to meet someone in Gardena -- they're living in Coos Bay, Oregon, now -- they, his name is George Tanaka. Well, his wife, Betsy, her grandfather was also involved in the creation of the Buddhist temple in Papaikou, and turns out that there is a photograph that was taken in Hawaii and her grandfather's in that photograph and so is my grandfather.

SY: That's great. Wow. That's very nice, 'cause the church, in essence, is still there, not in actuality.

GN: Yeah.

SY: So I guess the next question, unless there's some, is there anything else interesting about your family that we should talk about? I was gonna...

GN: Well, it's interesting because I know, my wife, Helen, mentioned about her father's family, there was a period where the oldest son, I don't know what generation, but gambled and had to relinquish a lot of the family heirlooms to pay for the debt that he created. Well, a similar thing happened in our family, not my grandfather but I think it might've been the grandfather's father or maybe, I'm not quite sure the generation, but ended up doing the same thing, gambled and had to sell the family heirlooms. So when I went to Japan in 1966 there was only one sword that was left that, and it wasn't in very good condition, that the family had, but the rest were all sold to pay for the gambling debt. But it seemed like there's always one like that in every family.

SY: [Laughs] So it is really kind of fortunate that your grandfather had this property that became so valuable.

GN: Yes.

SY: And your, and your uncle is still alive?

GN: No, he passed away about two years ago.

SY: So he really profited from it and led a very wealthy life, then, in Japan afterwards?

GN: Yes, mostly land was developed on that one side.

SY: Wow, that's great. That's good he had an interest in your family background.

GN: Well the other thing that's interesting is my father's younger sister married a career military officer in Japan, and he happened to come to the United States in 1964. And I could speak a little Japanese, so I was able to talk to him, but he mentioned to me that he became a commander of a POW camp in the Philippines toward the end of the war and the one thing that my grandfather had told him was that not to abuse POWs, and that the culture is different. The values that you have in Japan, you don't ever surrender. If you surrender you have lost your soul, and so they don't treat you as a human being anymore. But apparently my grandfather told him that's not so in the Western nation and so not to abuse POWs, and that's, I think he, that stuck with him. And so he was telling me that while he was in charge of the prison camp, he had ordered his subordinate not to mistreat POWs, and that the highest ranking officer was a U.S. Army colonel and he would invite him to eat with him at the same time whenever he had breakfast, lunch and dinner, and whenever he had cigarettes he would offer cigarettes to him, and they would eat the same food. And when the war was over he feels that he was the only one that was in charge of a prison camp that went straight back to his home in Hiroshima, whereas others were ordered to go to Sugamo prison near Tokyo.

SY: Wow. That's a terrific story. Yeah, so your family had, in essence there were people on both sides of the war during World War II.

GN: Yes.

SY: That really is amazing. Okay, so I guess we should --

GN: I have an uncle on my mom's side that was in the E Company in the 442nd, and Bob Ishikawa, who just passed away recently, they were in the same unit, along with Senator Inouye. He was part of the E Company in the 442nd.

SY: Wow. Amazing to have family on both sides like that.

<End Segment 3> - Copyright © 2011 Densho. All Rights Reserved.