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TI: And when you were reunited with your parents, did you notice any difference in your father from before the war and after?

MH: Yeah. He was a little more apprehensive. I think he still felt that he was being followed. But in my senior year in high school I was able to go to East Denver High School, which is one of the better high schools in Denver. I was lucky. But he suffered a stroke in December of 1945 and was paralyzed on his left side, so after that he could no longer work.

TI: You mentioned that he seemed more apprehensive.

MH: Yeah.

TI: Anything else in terms of physically, was he, did he look the same?

MH: Physically he was looking fine, yeah.

TI: Did he ever talk about it or did you hear anything?

MH: No, he never talked about anything.

TI: So you mentioned earlier that he went to Fort Missoula. Where else did he go?

MH: Lordsburg and Santa Fe, New Mexico.

TI: And, okay, so we do that, and then he had a stroke. At this point I want, I know you've done quite a bit of research. You requested the files for your father. I guess the first question is, why did you do that? Why did you want to see the files?

MH: I just wanted to know what happened, because my father never said anything about what happened. And from the FBI report I can see that he was questioned on certain dates and what he said he did. Yeah. And they're pretty much, everyone says the same thing, that he worked at the Holland Hotel, took around the army, naval officers, that he belonged to the Hinomarukai and the Dai Nippon Budokai, and each hearing it seemed like he said the same thing. Then he finally had a rehearing a couple years later, and they decided that he had a good record at Lordsburg and an outstanding record in Santa Fe and that he never requested to be repatriated and that he should be paroled.

TI: When I glanced through the documents, something that I've read about, and this is actually the first time I've seen it on an individual file, you always hear about the ABC lists, that the FBI and naval intelligence had compiled lists even before the war with A being the most dangerous, B being, B being kind of potentially dangerous, and C possibly being dangerous. And I noticed that your father was marked A.

MH: A, yeah.

TI: And why do you think he was listed so high in terms of, of being dangerous?

MH: Because he took around the people from the Japanese Imperial Navy and visited the consul general and, and had dealings with other important Japanese visitors, and also because he belonged to these organizations.

TI: But everything you've mentioned, there's nothing, he didn't break any laws. I mean, there's nothing wrong that he had done, other than being associated with various individuals.

MH: No.

TI: I mean, was there anything in the files that indicated that he had done something wrong?

MH: No, just that he took these naval officers, they usually would want to go to Bremerton or Sand Point or, I think they were interested in Boeing, but apparently they were allowed to come to this country to visit.

TI: And these were all potential, I guess, military intelligence type of things, like Boeing aircraft or the Bremerton shipyard.

MH: Yeah. Shipyards.

TI: Sand Point was another naval station.

MH: Naval station, yeah.

TI: So the, it's interesting, so the Japanese navy guys wanted to see these different places and your dad would bring 'em.

MH: Bring 'em, yeah, 'cause he had the car. They stayed at the hotel; he accommodated them like a tourist.

TI: The other thing I saw on there was a reference to your father taking pictures of the Grand Coulee Dam.

MH: Yeah.

TI: And so tell me about that. What, what was...

MH: We went on a family trip to Grand Coulee Dam soon after they opened, or not that they opened, that they started operations. And it was a family trip, my mother and father and my sister and myself, and my younger brother, I think. We all went. And we also visited my father's friend out in Toppenish, Washington, and it also said we went to Portland, Oregon, and I only remember these things 'cause the FBI recorded it.

TI: So how would they know all this in terms of where you went?

MH: Some, it says an informant said that that's what we did and the dates that we went. But also, in the letter my brother Jim had written to a niece, he says -- he was a Boy Scout in Seattle, he and my brother Bill, and in order to go on a trip they had to be second class Scout, and they were both second class Scouts so they were able to go on this trip to Grand Coulee Dam soon after it opened with the Boy Scouts. But he said went on such a dilapidated bus that they had a lot of flat tires and blowouts, and so he said when they ran out of tires that's where they camped. But, see, everybody was going to see the Grand Coulee Dam. It was something to see.

TI: But what's interesting is that, so it wasn't necessarily that the FBI was tailing them. It was that an informant perhaps talked to your dad after the trip, wrote that all down --

MH: Wrote it down, yeah maybe.

TI: -- and then supplied that to the FBI.

MH: Could be.

TI: Interesting.

MH: But, you know, it was the Boy Scouts who went too, and I imagine other groups made trips to the Grand Coulee Dam.

TI: The other thing you showed me were these photographs from the Department of Justice camp, and it looked like your dad was an avid tennis player.

MH: Yes.

TI: And so they had pictures of that. Did your dad ever talk about playing tennis or anything like that?

MH: No. I've never seen him play tennis. But in another letter that, another internee in camp said that while in camp my dad played tennis and softball and that he voluntarily worked in the kitchen, and while in Santa Fe he took upon the responsibilities of policing and fire inspection. So that's what he did in addition to his sports activities.

TI: Oh, so he was kind of policing, almost like internal policing and things?

MH: Probably. Yeah.

TI: And that's probably why, you said that his record was so strong that, the second, second hearing, they decided to release him.

MH: The rehearing, yeah. Said he was...

TI: Now let's talk a little bit about your mother. How did your father's absence affect her during this time period?

MH: Well, she had to be responsible for the family. It's amazing, when I think about it, how she was able to make so many moves. But, yeah, she was a strong person. And when she came to America, you know, she was saying, the whole family came to join my grandfather because he was in the States by himself then, and they were, my grandmother and four children, she says they all came on first class train and then came on a first class boat, and my grandfather had bought new furniture and a new house on Beacon Hill for them. And when they came, she said, there was many delicious dishes and fruits and flowers that the people from the office and the kenjinkai people had arranged for them, so she really had a great welcome to the United States. And she said her father even bought her a new piano.

TI: So your grandfather was, his business was really lucrative.

MH: Was well to do. Yeah. But then he built on the two extra stories to the hotel, and I think that sapped his resources.

TI: Okay.

<End Segment 14> - Copyright © 2011 Densho. All Rights Reserved.