<Begin Segment 19>

KN: Since you graduated, what did you do in the meantime?

HM: The biggest mistake I made in my life was I didn't go to university. Why? In 1943 the war was, war was war. It was really going at it, so few of our friends got together, why go to university? We may not be alive tomorrow That's the attitude. I didn't think, so that was the biggest mistake I made in my life, not going to college.

KN: What, what did you want to become, if you did in fact go to college?

HM: I wanted to be a social worker. I have proof because we had a Japanese school yearbook and I said I wanted to be a social worker. Don't ask me where I got it, but that's what I said, I wanted to be a social worker.

KN: But war changed all of that and a lot of people's attitudes, I guess. When you met together and you talked with your friends and said, "We may not be alive then."

HM: Yeah, that's what we thought, why go to school? We may not be alive tomorrow. But that was my biggest mistake I've made in my life. But I didn't let that get me down. [Laughs]

KN: So what did you do, since you couldn't go to school?

HM: I worked for the, I worked for the military and, of course, the pay was good. Money was so... so did I save? No, I spent it. Here again, may not gonna be alive tomorrow. Bad attitude, but you know, that's what was in my mind.

KN: So what kind of jobs did you do?

HM: I worked for the army ordinance depot, at Fort Shafter. But the thing that, you've heard of the black badge, because we were Japanese we had to, that was the worst thing. My best friend, Chinese girl -- I won't mention her name -- she called me "Jap." We were the best of friends. We shared our lives, we talked about, we talked about our personal life. Nothing was hidden, everything was on the, open to the table. And yet when I started wearing black badge I got called "Jap." It was embarrassing to wear the black badge when everybody else had white badge. Why should I punished?

TI: And for your friend to call you that, so she would know you --

HM: She was my best friend. We shared lives. We shared our secrets and everything, and yet...

TI: So why do you think she changed her attitude? She knew you before.

HM: I think they were afraid of being friends with Japanese. I've never asked them, but I'm sure they were afraid, because I've heard a story about German family, even the aunt didn't want to help the children because she was afraid to be caught. So I think there must've been some, somewhere along the line they may get into trouble. I never found out, but I'm sure that's how they felt.

TI: It was almost like she wanted to show people that the Japanese weren't her friends so she would do that to her best friend.

HM: Yeah, I don't know whether that was her, her thinking, but it could be fear being a friend of Japanese, thinking they may get picked up also. This was still 1943 now, so when I think about it even now, I hated it, but I don't, I don't hate her anymore. I don't know what happened to her, but I don't, when I talk about it, I don't hate her.

TI: So besides wearing the black badge, what are some other examples of the Japanese being singled out and, and more difficult?

HM: That we, we had to go through the gate, we even had to open our bags to show that we had nothing in the bag, even our lunch paper bag we had to open up. I hated that. And then we would, if our friends are not feeling well, we would give them a call to see, and then if the mother's not feeling well, the father, "How's Okaasan?" Clink, you could, telephone conversation were cut, because even the telephone was censored. You couldn't use Japanese words.

TI: And this was when you were at work, or just everywhere?

HM: Everywhere. I mean, that's my experience now. I'm sure it happened to other people, too.

TI: So your sense was whenever Japanese was used someone was listening?

HM: Then my father used to say, "Don't say anything because you don't know who's listening."

KN: So there was no Japanese language spoken at home?

HM: No, you couldn't. You couldn't speak Japanese.

TI: How about acts of kindness? It was hard to be Japanese, did you ever come across someone who went out of their way to help you because you were Japanese?

HM: Well, I don't know about that. I, maybe it happened, but I don't think it happened to me. In the whole, people were nice. People are nice, so it could have happened, but it's a good thing I didn't remember that bad part of that story. I can just remember the nice, nice thing. Of course, I remember the horrible things I went through, but something like that, it's not in my mind anymore. When I talk about it I'll think about it, but other than that, uh-uh.

<End Segment 19> - Copyright © 2011 Densho. All Rights Reserved.