<Begin Segment 11>

TI: So as all this is going on, it's almost like this transformation. It's interesting that you change your name about this time, too, from Patti Jo to PJ.

PJH: Yes.

TI: Did you consciously change your name? I mean, was this something as part of your transformation?

PJH: Yes.

TI: Do you consciously remember, "I'm gonna change my name to PJ"?

PJH: Uh-huh.

TI: And, okay.

PJH: It just felt, well, there were a number of things that went into that. It's kind of like discarding that past that was painful and not being into my, my name to begin with. PJ was also something that could not, I could not be distinguished either male or female, so I liked that. Yeah.

TI: And personality-wise, what, how, what did you transform... I have a sense of where you were before, but what, how would describe your transformation?

PJH: Transformation, becoming a lot more verbal. I would say confident. Main thing is, like, I didn't get on the track of the expectation of my parents. I wanted to go into social science, I wanted to become social worker, and my father would say, "Don't be a social worker. That's the system that's gonna rip all the taxpayers off." [Laughs] And anything that was kind of like into community or social service, it was not going to pay the bills. That was the fear. I had also taken some art classes and some music classes when I was at Cal State Hayward, in between that math and where am I gonna go next, and I would hear, get an earful from my parents, "Well, that's not gonna pay the bills. Get something that you can fall back on." Once I transferred to Berkeley there was --

TI: And before we go there, I just want to touch on, just so that, 'cause I asked Roy the same question, but in that punch card class was the first time you met Roy?

PJH: Yes.

TI: So tell me about that in terms of your first impressions of Roy.

PJH: [Laughs]

TI: [Laughs] Now this is recorded. Could be edited, though.

PJH: Hi, Roy. No, let's see, it was a summer school class and I just remember, I think there was just, he and I were the only Asians in the class. I just remember him being kind of a skinny Asian boy and I, to this day I do remember his watch being, being worn up his forearm, so I go, he's pretty skinny. [Laughs] Just a really nice guy, helped me out in the class, no, no romantic interest at all.

TI: But you approached him, you asked him to help you?

PJH: No, we were always sitting at the table and trying to do our, our programs. He did ask me to go out and it's like, I don't know if I really want to go out, but, oh, I do like Blood, Sweat & Tears. [Laughs] So he got tickets to go see Blood, Sweat & Tears, and he had to come to our home in Fremont, pick me up, and my mom, I think both my parents met him and they go, "Oh, what a nice boy. What a nice boy." I think they just trying to get me to go date somebody, another Asian boy. I said, "Yeah, he's a nice guy," but that's it.

TI: Okay, good story. I, yeah, I just wanted to, to get your side of the story. Roy tells it a little bit differently, so... he doesn't give as many details.

PJH: Oh, okay, okay. [Laughs]

<End Segment 11> - Copyright © 2011 Densho. All Rights Reserved.