<Begin Segment 35>

TI: Well, that's a great way to end this interview. I think this really captures, I think, a lot of the themes that we've covered. Before I end the interview, is there anything else that you want to talk about, like your family or anything? I'm not sure if you want to...

HN: My family, yeah. My father and mother never came back. My mother never came back, but talking to them in their late life, we relaxed, having coffee, having beer, and they never once regret what they did. Well, I guess they must have been satisfied that they did what they had to do.

TI: How about your older brother? Have you ever talked to him about his decisions and how that, what that meant to his life?

HN: Yeah, well, he was resentful for what happened, and he says, "Okay, but I'm not gonna have that thing hanging over me and drag me down," and that's bygone as far as he was concerned. But he says, "I will never give the country another chance to do that to me again."

TI: Yeah, so it sounds like there's still pain and resentment there.

HN: Yeah. Oh yeah.

TI: And your younger brother, does he?

HN: No, he doesn't. He, he was so small when they came back, came to Japan, went to Japan. He was nine years old, ten years. And he did all his education in Japan, through university. Rikkyo Saint Paul University, Tokyo. That's one of the big six university in Tokyo.

TI: So did he stay in Japan all this --

HN: No, he came back.

TI: He came back.

HN: He came back as soon as he finished his education. Came to Hawaii and right off the bat, he was drafted. [Laughs]

TI: Because, right, he retained his U.S. citizenship, and so... okay.

HN: He was successful in his career and he's working for the Japanese, big trading company.

TI: Good. Okay, so at this point I'm going to go ahead and end the interview, again, with my deep thanks for sharing. This was, this was a pretty amazing interview. Thank you very much.

HN: Oh, thank you.

[Interruption]

HN: In 1952, when the renunciation was null and void, that's when I feel my life completely changed. Until then it was, my life was confrontational and tumultuous, but after 1952, deciding to join the Air Force and with all the fortunate experience of meeting good people -- Americans -- and starting the second phase of my American life, with the, joining the Air Force, I feel that I was fortunate to have a good career in the Air Force and with the U.S. civil service. And I have forgiven, but I have not forgotten.

TI: Well, in fact, I want to ask you, so 1952 is when you were able to get your citizenship back.

HN: Yes, right.

TI: Do you have a different appreciation of what it means to be a U.S. citizen?

HN: Yes.

TI: Because you had it, then you gave it up, then you got it back, I'm wondering what, so what does U.S. citizenship mean to you?

HN: Well, to me, having lived in Japan until then, Japan society is not as open as U.S. In the Meiji Restoration, that was only one hundred fifty years ago. They still carry that, the feudal type lifestyle. That I did not like. Although, all the confrontation and bitter experience, I still desired the openness of the American life.

TI: And so your time in Japan made you appreciate more the openness?

HN: Yes, openness.

TI: But I'm wondering if things changed, because -- well, maybe you didn't realize the openness at first, but just, when you lose something, I wonder if it means something more when you get it back. Because we talked about earlier, you talked about how maybe some people are, like, super patriots, but, but I think you may have a better appreciation of what citizenship means.

HN: Yeah, well, I'm not, as a person went through the tumultuous experience in life, I'm not blind to the dark side of the American society, or the, any other country has a dark side. But, still, on the bright side, there's more, to me, a more positive aspect in the American life than in the Japanese life. I was fortunate to, able to, able to appraise that... I appraised the value of the two society and I feel the open, the brighter side of American life was a better way of going. That was my feeling.

TI: Good. Okay, well thank you, Hank. That was a good way to end the, the interview.

<End Segment 35> - Copyright © 2010 Densho. All Rights Reserved.