<Begin Segment 9>

MN: Which block did you live in?

JM: Eleven, Block 11, which was sort of near the very top. It was Block 11 and 12 and then the fence.

MN: And I know the Terminal Islanders lived in Block, mainly Block 9 and 10.

MN: Nine and ten.

MN: And you sort of mentioned already your article on "The Stray Cats of Manzanar," but if you could share some of what went on between your block and the Terminal Islanders.

JM: Terminal Islanders were a tough, tough bunch. Their fathers were fishermen, primarily, and that's a tough breed. I mean tough. One of them got bit by a scorpion, the father. He just took a knife and cut himself in the butt, bleeding, he says, "I'll just patch it up." I mean, to him, going to seek medical help was like, just don't do it. These guys were like, they fell off a boat, they expect you to swim on and jump back in there, you know. And oh, they would, if their kids were out of line, they'd give 'em what they call a yaito, which is a burn. They literally burn you. So I remember seeing my friend with actual burn marks. I mean, that would put, in this day and age, that would put you under child... well, they would grab the kids, put 'em under child welfare situation, you would be, you would be in jail for child abuse. But that was common. You got out of line, and you got a yaito. So these Terminal Island kids were tough. And the older kids would, they would play every, every (day). I think every block had a basketball court or something like that. The Terminal Islanders would come to Block 11 to play. And arguments would break out, you know like you could see it. And all these (fights) were (from) the heat of the moment, and so the Terminal Islanders would start fighting the L.A. guys. The L.A. older guys were (from) Block 11. We had a mix of Terminal Islanders in L.A. and also, too, among the Terminal Islanders, they had a lot of these, what they call yogore, meaning, translated means "dirty." And they loved to walk around with their corduroy pants, filthy is the only way to describe it, dirt on them. But that means they were bad-asses, you know, sort of like wearing a bandana or tattoos, having tattoos all over their neck, you know. It was the equivalent of that. If you walked around with a dirty corduroy and grimy is the only word for it, the dirtier the better, and you would have an actual chain, like a zoot suit or chain, that meant you were a bad-ass. Someone wanted to mess with you, they'd have a go at it. Well, anyway, us younger kids would feed off of what the older kids were doing.

So every afternoon at one o'clock, the Terminal Island kids would come across the firebreak, and we'd meet them on our side of it and we'd have at it, and we'd have our supply of rocks and green apples, and boy, we'd be pitching it. And I would deliberately have a straw hat on there. Because I think they outnumbered us two to one, and after a while, the rain of missiles was bouncing off of our, you know, this hat, and we'd have to run for it. But hey, we're there every day at one, you know, going at it. And that was my recollection of the Terminal Island folks.

MN: You know that term "yogore," is that something that came out of the war years, or is that something that before the war, was that term used?

JM: I'm sure it's before the war, because that's around... it could have been, but it really reached, I think it really reached its height in the camp area. Because they loved to run around with the zoot suit chains. I think even we were wearing (it), we began to wear (it in) imitation of the older people, older kids, the zoot suit chains. But we weren't dirty.

MN: And you mentioned you had Terminal Islanders on your block.

JM: Yeah.

MN: Now, which side did they go on?

JM: Oh, they weren't fighting with us. It wasn't a Terminal Island versus L.A. thing, it was more like Block 9 and 10 versus Block 11. So the Terminal Islanders on Block 11 were on our side.

MN: Now, I know the Bainbridge Island people were also close by. Did you have any contact with them?

JM: No, I have no idea who they were.

<End Segment 9> - Copyright © 2010 Densho. All Rights Reserved.