<Begin Segment 2>

MN: Now, can you share with us again, when you were working in the mayor's office, you also got a call from the White House. And can you share with us that story, how you got selected and how they got your name?

RO: Well, actually, we were skiing in Utah with UCLA classmates, and someone said, "The White House called." And I said, "Sure." It was actually the White House, and they were asking me to serve on the Select Commission on Immigration and Refugee Policy. And when I took the call, I said, "Number one, I don't know anything about immigration. How about So-and-so and So-and-so?" And they let me know that I had been selected, and that they are ready to convene. I said, "Why me?" And there were two individuals, Norman Locke, he and his wife Esther, where were very much involved in the Carter campaign, and that they insisted that... this is an unusual body. It's made up of four senators, four congressional members, and four cabinet members, four public members, and I was going to be the Asian representative. That they asked that they select that person. And when I asked them some time later, "Why did you pick me? I don't know anything about immigration," and they said that they had heard that I'm not afraid of anyone. And part of that comes from, I was a civil rights lawyer and I was in Legal Services, so you're always fighting the dragons and all. But in City Hall, I had a reputation of taking on the police chief. He's a pretty notorious police chief, Ed Davis.

And can I share my story when I met him? I went to see him after I was appointed, when my boss was appointed to the bench, he recommended that I succeed him. So I went over to see the chief and I said, "Chief, I'm going to be the director." He said, "Oh, no. Tom Bradley, he went and done it again. A woman, a lawyer, an ACLU type?" And I said, "Chief, you know what? Think about it this way. It's like a pickup basketball game. Sometimes you're skins and sometimes you're shirts." He said, "You be skins." You know, he had this wonderful sense of humor. We didn't agree on policy, but we recognized that when we were fighting the state or fighting the county, that I was going to be leading the charge, and we became fast friends. I believe, though... I, my father was a kind man. And if you grow up and you're not afraid of your father, then you're not afraid of strong men, and I think that helped a lot later in my career.

MN: So that's where you sort of got this reputation of being fearless, 'cause you were able to take on the LAPD chief of police, okay. So now, when you get this call from the White House, Mayor Tom Bradley gives you an option. And can you tell us what the option was and what you chose to do?

RO: The mayor, the mayor actually supported all my involvements, whether it was with the bar or with Japanese American community. And in this case, this is going to be a major commitment. We would be going back to Washington to deliberate, conduct hearings, etcetera. And he said, "Rose, you can go on company time." And I said, "No, I'm gonna go on vacation, because I'm gonna say whatever I have on mind."

MN: So you wanted that freedom, okay. Now, can you share with us that first meeting on that select commission, what you said?

RO: Well, this was the opening, and there are speeches from the chairs, Hesburgh, and the chairs of the judiciary committee. You had Rodino and all the dignitaries speaking. And they're about ready to close, and I says, "Excuse me." And I just spoke very briefly. I said, "Historically, immigration and refugee policy has been arbitrary and discriminatory racially, and that as we proceed, we need to be mindful of this and work appropriately." I didn't tell him the story that my mother and father were subject to deportation after we were released from internment.

MN: Well, you also were sort of the lone voice for protecting family preference?

RO: Well, what happened is... we had a lot of so-called liberals. It was during the commission's life, the administration changed from Carter to Reagan, and people started to shift. And there was a chance that the fifth preference, the reunification of brothers and sisters, was in danger. So there didn't seem to be any other voices, people felt that that was one that have to, to give away. And one day, we took a break, and I went over and I was talking to a Representative McClory, a conservative Republican from Chicago. And I learned that his daughter-in-law was Chinese, and she, we talked about family reunification. When we came back from break, McClory stands up and speaks on the issue. Senator Kennedy turned and stared at me, because I guess he assumed it came from me. But I, I've always made it a practice to work both sides of the aisle. We've done that in City Hall, and we'd done it for Manzanar.

MN: What sort of opportunities were open to you when you served on this commission?

RO: Well, you know, you're... these are the top leaders of the judiciary, and we were able to form some very fast friendships, because we conduct hearings, have dinners. I remember going to dinner with Alan Simpson, Senator Alan Simpson from Wyoming, and he told the story that when he was a young Boy Scout, that he and his troop went into the internment camp Heart Mountain to have... what do they call it? A powwow with the Boy Scouts, Japanese American Boy Scouts. And they camped and played together, and they made fast friends. And one of them was Norman Mineta. And they were pen pals for many, many years, and I had an opportunity to share that story when Ms. Reno was gonna do the keynote speech for the groundbreaking for the National Japanese American Memorial Foundation. I asked her, they needed a speaker, and then if you something like that, then you are stuck writing the speech. But I used that opportunity to insert that story. But, you know, history is actually made by relationships, and those two work together on redress. But redress had its ups and downs, as you know, and I had an opportunity to work for JACL at the time when I was the national vice president of membership.

<End Segment 2> - Copyright © 2010 Densho. All Rights Reserved.