<Begin Segment 5>

MN: So now we're at Rohwer. Can you share with us how you got your name, your name "Rose" at Rohwer?

RO: Let's see. I was going to go to school, and we were all told to line up and we were gonna be given American names. And as you know, my parents named me Takayo, and it was supposed to be "a child of high ideals." So they decided to name me Rose. Do you know, again -- and this is now in my adult life, trying to think about what kind of castrating effect psychologically this could have, be for a young girl. And I've given it a lot of thought, and I felt initially that you're made to feel that you're not a real American, and what you are is not good enough. But over time, I've kind of come to understand that it was very empowering. Because I don't have to belong. To the extent that I have been very successful as an advocate in the community and in my work, I tend to be fearless. And it didn't matter whether you blessed my positions, and I have many stories to tell. [Laughs]

MN: I'm trying to imagine this, being lined up, and they just, did they just go down the line with the children, and did they just give out random names, or were you able to choose?

RO: I think they just went through a book. But also, when I've given talks before, I've said, "Hey, I consider myself lucky. What if I got 'Petunia'?"

MN: And after that, did you go by Rose at home, or was it still...

RO: No, Ta-chan.

MN: Ta-chan. So your parents called you Ta-chan.

RO: Ta-chan. We spoke Japanese at home.

MN: Now, at Rohwer, I know Mary Nakahara, also known as Yuri Kochiyama, I've been told that she used to take the girls out hiking outside the camp. Were you too young to be involved in those kind of activities?

RO: I don't know. I definitely know and admire her, but I don't recall whether I participated with her. But I do know that initially, there were guards with rifles in the guard towers. But as, towards the end of our, what, almost three years there, they were liberalizing the policies. And the young kids, I know, we snuck off and went fishing or catching frogs or whatever. And I remember the people in the area are, nobody was ugly. They were all pretty much economically challenged people living there in this cotton-filled area and swamp.

MN: What do you recall about those people?

RO: Hmm?

MN: What do you recall about the people out in Arkansas area?

RO: The one thing that I can recall is a Christmas party. So we all were given a gift, and I got these little, not even plastic, like little plastic little charms. And it was such a special, special gift from Santa Claus. And now, as an adult at Christmastime, I make sure that I make a contribution to the gift, because for us, our parents had, they had no way to get us any gifts, and it was very important.

MN: So these are the people from the local area that donated?

RO: Local people.

MN: George Takei tells a story quite a lot how --

RO: I tell him to stop doing it. [Laughs]

MN: -- how he shared a bed with you. Can you tell us that story?

RO: Yeah. George's mother and my mother were friends, probably from sewing. But George and I both had our tonsils out. Now, I will say this: it's possible that they were using us children for advancing medicine and trying new techniques, 'cause I don't know necessarily whether we needed to have our tonsils taken out. I have to say something. [Laughs] But George and I ended up sharing a bed. We were probably around, what, five or six years old, and so our parents visited, and I was jumping up and down, and George was moaning and groaning, "Ohhh." So George's mother said to my mother, "Oh, your daughter's so genki, would you..." I don't know the term, but, "could you betroth your daughter for my son George?" And so one time when I was in the City of Los Angeles and there was an event, and we were talking about redress and internment, I told that story, and George was in the audience. And the next thing I know, he's telling it all over the place. [Laughs] So we kind of joke around, yeah, we've been in bed together.

MN: That's a great story. Now, in Rohwer, your mother was pregnant with Takeshi Donald. Can you share a little bit about what happened to him?

RO: Well, you know, again, I was a young girl. But from what I understand, that people don't know what the future holds, and they have no ability to change their circumstances. So a lot of women, there were a lot of mental health challenges, but a lot of women tried to terminate their pregnancies. And my mother had told me at some point that she tried, using whatever kind of home remedies that the women were using. But she didn't go through with it entirely, and anyway, he was affected. He was smart in many ways, but he had some shortcomings in other ways. He didn't live long after we were released. He was in his early teens, I'd say, ten, twelve, or something like that.

MN: Are there other recollections of Rohwer that you have?

RO: Well, you know, I don't know. A lot of it is I'm sure there was a lot of depression, and there was just a lot of challenges in families because parents are not in authority. But our family was a little different. We didn't have, like, teenage boys. Now, my sister... my sister graduated high school at Rohwer, and I'm sure there was special challenges for the girls. Lot of these women, the men went off to join the army, and so there's probably a big generation of spinsters also, you know, that artificial kind of barriers. But my father, I don't know why, because he's not a strong, dominant personality, but for whatever, people seemed to look up to him. So he was a block manager, and then because I guess he spoke English, he somehow was called in to probably be involved in a lot of conversations with camp administrators and all. I think that, to the extent that we could have our needs taken care of, it was satisfying. But for my brother and I, you know there's a lot of anger, sadness and everything around, but there was time for us to chase butterflies or catch frogs or whatever. It was probably a good time.

MN: Now, the "loyalty questionnaire," was that ever an issue in the family?

RO: No, I don't recall that at all. Maybe my father, I don't know, he was probably too old to go to the army.

MN: But they never, you never overheard them say, "Well, you know, we're going to go back to Japan, let's go to Tule Lake"?

RO: No. You know, my father didn't immigrate here. He came over on kind of a treaty, trader kind of a visa, so perhaps it didn't apply somehow.

<End Segment 5> - Copyright © 2010 Densho. All Rights Reserved.