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MN: Now, I'm gonna jump to Pearl Harbor, and you were only three years old when Pearl Harbor happened, but do you remember Pearl Harbor at all, or how your family changed?

RO: No. I'm sure as a child I could sense the fear and all the calamity and all. But I don't know, there's something about, my parents also probably tried to insulate us and make us feel comfortable as best we could.

MN: Did they tell you you were going to some sort of camp? Do you remember them getting luggage ready?

RO: It's interesting. Maybe lot of this you just kind of absorb and remember subliminally, but the whole idea of trying to decide what you're gonna take. I have a little bit of idiosyncrasy. I'm sort of gone over the top, and gathering Japanese Imari plates and tea sets and tansus. My house can't hold it. When I get these postcards, you know, new ship came in, and I just feel like I have to get... and, I mean, all these things, I have my name on 'em. And I mean, I go over here regularly when there's a warehouse sale. I mean, I'm serious. I'm on a bed with no makeup on, just be there the first in line. And there's something to be said, somehow, I think certain pieces, like, belonged to me. There's going to be a limit, there's no place to put the stuff. But it's not a piece of art or a Sara plate somehow... I don't know why. I don't know why.

MN: But somehow it might have been the effects of the camp, or having to go to camp, or having to leave...

RO: Dispossess yourself. And my parents had nice things, 'cause they were in importing, and people gave, Japanese, gifts is very important, so they always had lot of wonderful, nice things. There was one Imari plate, and I don't know where it is, but I've been running around trying to find it. [Laughs]

[Interruption]

MN: I know you were really young, but do you have any idea how your family got to Santa Anita?

RO: No. I imagine we were just loaded up in buses. I believe that you, everybody had to go line up at Nishi, and that was my parents' church.

MN: And at that time, Nishi Hongwanji is the current center where the museum is. That's where you lined up from?

RO: That's where we were lined up.

MN: What do you recall of your six-month stay at Santa Anita? Do you recall anything?

RO: I don't think I can remember any particular event or thing, but it's another way of remembering. You know George Yoshinaga has these Santa Anita reunions? I mean, he and Mike Antonovich were very instrumental in dedicating Santa Anita as a relocation center, what is it, an assembly area. And so I went to one of the events, and it was going to be an event with a tour, luncheon, and horse racing, all a part of the package. And I remember, after the program and during a tour of the assembly center, I was just really overcome with emotion. I didn't know whether it was allergy, reacting to the hay and the seasonal allergies, but I just was overcome with tears and all. And I decided not to, to stay that day. And when I give speeches and I talk about being, living in horse stables, I talk about it was horse stables that were not actually cleaned out, they just whitewashed the manure. And so the stench and all the hay, the pollens, whatever, it's all a very visible part of my memories. And so I think that day that I was there, it just triggered all that. And so it's a funny thing about being subliminal. Do you know that I've been a part of the Manzanar Committee for many years, and in the past, we used to put together a big buffet, a picnic. And I went into town to just buy whatever, cookies, crackers, to put out. And I ate some ginger snaps and I became very nauseous. And when I came home, I told my mother, I said, "You know, I ate ginger snaps and I loved them, remember? Didn't I like ginger snaps?" She said, "You ate them on the train ride all the way to Rohwer from Los Angeles," and that, "you were throwing up." So there's something to be said about, you know, what kind of memories that reside in different places.

MN: Thank you for sharing that. So, and just to be, to clarify, when you went to George Yoshinaga's event, was that the day the plaque was being dedicated?

RO: I think it was the next, the next event he had.

MN: Okay, got it, okay.

<End Segment 4> - Copyright © 2010 Densho. All Rights Reserved.