<Begin Segment 22>

CH: But a lot of people were, and you ever heard of Meatball Kawakita? You don't know, you don't know the voice of... what do you call that?

MN: Tokyo Rose?

CH: Tokyo Rose. You heard of Tokyo Rose? I know the family in Chicago. And then you never heard of Meatball Kawakita? Oh. You know, he was American-born, Imperial Valley, okay? Then he got, he went to Japan to see grandfather or mother or something, then he got caught in the war. But since he know how to speak English and Japanese, the government, since he was dual citizen, government made him a special guard to guard the POW. And he really treated 'em real bad, you know that? He treated 'em bad. And this other, my friend, he treated 'em good. Guy named... I forgot his name. That guy, Meatball, he treated 'em bad. After the war, he came back home. He was shopping at Broadway, Broadway that department store? One POW spot 'em. "What the hell this guy doing here?" He spot 'em, FBI arrested him right away. Then he went to trial and they said he's, verdict was treason. You're supposed to kill them, treason. But they gave him one more chance. "If you return to Japan, we'll let you go." He went back to Japan and he's still there, Japan. And his father, his father, you know, he was a millionaire. He was the richest guy in Imperial Valley, and his father was Kawakita Oyaji. And I used to deliver letter. He's the only one get letters, that much. I told him, "Ojichan, hey, how come you get so much letter?" He's a big businessman. So I start talking with him. He's the one that told me, "Hey, Hamasaki-san, when you do something and think about something, do it. Do it. You'll never regret it afterwards if you do this." I followed the thing he do, he told me. And I asked, "How come you're so famous Imperial Valley?" He owned this and that, and one big mistake investment was Manchurian railroad, he told me. "What's that got to do, Manchurian railroad?" Oh, I made a lot of money from Russia to Manchuria. The railroad they made. He was one of the investors. He was telling me all different kind of story. Yeah, he was already, always thinking that guy, all by himself. Well, I thought, "He's a little off," I thought, you know. Hell no, he gave me a good advice, that guy. So that's what I tell all my kids, whatever thing I do. "And don't forget obligation," I tell my kids. But like my other kids, you give 'em something, they don't thank. I told my kid, I disciplined.

MN: Let me ask a little bit about Kawakita. You met after the war...

CH: No, before the war.

MN: Yeah, during the war, the father was at Bismarck, Fort Lincoln.

CH: Yeah, same barrack.

MN: Then after the war, you ran into the Kawakita family in Los Angeles.

CH: Oh, yeah, I was selling, I was a salesman. I was selling a few things.

MN: At that time, was Meatball already on trial when you...

CH: At that time? I think he was, I think he went back for trial maybe. I was a salesman 1952 and '53, I think. That's the time I met him, '52/'53. 'Cause I came back from South America '53. So '53/'54, '54. Maybe he got, he went Japan maybe, after trial probably. '54, that's why.

MN: Do you know why he got the nickname "Meatball"?

CH: Gee, I don't know. See, my good buddy just died couple of month ago, he was one of his good buddies from Imperial Valley. They went school together. He was telling me about Meatball. I never asked that guy, you know. I think they named him Meatball in Japan, I think, when he was a security guard over there, Kawakita. I talked to the sister when I went to sell 'em, "Kawakita, I know Kawakita." I didn't tell 'em about Meatball, though. Well, you know, I don't want to insult them or anything, that's why. "Yeah, I know your father," I tell 'em. "How come you know?" "Bismarck." "Oh, yeah." They thought I was lying, you know.

MN: But you didn't personally know Meatball? You knew the father, but not Meatball.

CH: Yeah, I never saw Meatball. And I never saw Tokyo Rose either. But Tokyo Rose had relatives, so I know. That was about 1946, '46.

TI: So, Charlie, I'm curious, at Bismarck, here you are with essentially all the leaders of the Japanese community from all of the different communities, Los Angeles, Seattle, Portland, Fresno, they're all together. How did they get along? Was there an order? I mean, were there some people who kind of rose to the top that people would look up to? Were there like leaders in the group?

CH: Yeah, that's a good question. You know, at my age, I didn't realize what they were doing. 'Cause even my, when I'm forty or fifty years old, I take interest in human being, you know. See how they get along together. When you're young, you don't think about those things. And what they talk about, besides, we're too young, so, "Hey, young men, get out of here," they tell you. I can't join the same conversation 'cause I don't have no interest with them. That's why I never listened what they were talking about. Like you said, yappari, they all get together, they got something to talk about, especially when they come from the same prefecture. Then they got lot of things to talk about. Or like me, I go all different place. At least I see one Terminal Island guy, I think... Grand Rapids, Michigan, I went there, one Terminal Island guy, I went to... well, I forgot that place, there was one guy. It's amazing. I go everywhere, there's some guy I know. It's amazing. One of my friends, he's a movie industry guy from Japan, he went to, I don't know, something, some place over there. You know, so they start talking about this and that and everything. So he asked him, "You ever heard of a guy named Charlie Hamasaki?" "Yeah, I know that guy." "Where?" "In the army." [Laughs] In the army. Yeah, he came back and said, "You know, there was a guy who knew you." "Who?" He mentioned the name, yeah, I was in the army. You never can tell. There were no Japanese when I first went to that kind of place. There was no Japanese, I was the only guy.

<End Segment 22> - Copyright © 2010 Densho. All Rights Reserved.