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BT: Well, after the Goodman decision, how long did you have to celebrate before the case was appealed by the Department of Justice?

TN: Well, I don't know, about six months.

BT: Did you expect the appeal?

TN: Well, we expected it, yeah. But meanwhile, the case was still, we opened the case up so that we could accept other renunciants to come into the case. That's where the Southern California Chamber of Commerce helped us in getting all the people to come in. We flooded the government with cases.

BT: Oh, you mean after the deal?

TN: After the decision. So we were able to... then a lot of people from Japan, we put 'em all in the five thousand people, everybody.

BT: Well, what was the timing of Wirin's filing, when Wirin filed the Murakami case? Was that after the Goodman decision, right?

TN: After, yeah. After, when they appealed the case.

BT: So it was happening during the appeal?

TN: Yeah. Well, I think they tried to file... the Murakami case came after that. I don't know if... which was which... prior or not. But the thing is, it left the government a leeway for them. They were giving an excuse for accepting renunciation. That was before we got the Goodman decision.

BT: So you, there was this awareness that Wirin was trying to put together his own case based on a totally different theory.

TN: Yeah.

BT: And what, you were also aware that he was looking for plaintiffs, right? That he was looking for plaintiffs in his case.

TN: Yeah, well, he was trying to get into the case.

BT: Yeah. And did you talk to any of those potential plaintiffs?

TN: Yeah, I told them. Then they told me that, well, naturally, time has passed, so a lot of people want to get their citizenship back fast. They figured that they had the individual priority, you know, so they wanted to, they could be solicited easily. They said, "Why don't you file your own suit and get your citizenship back?" While these people were in camp, they said, "We don't want our citizenship, we want to get out of the camp." Once they got outside, they want to get their citizenship back. But the thing is, a lot of people were riding on the back of other people, too.

BT: So how many people got their citizenship back in the Wirin case?

TN: Just one. One or two or three.

BT: And how many in the Collins case?

TN: Oh, five thousand. We got 'em all back.

<End Segment 16> - Copyright © 2009 Densho. All Rights Reserved.