<Begin Segment 9>

TI: Okay, so Frank, I'm going to move on. Earlier you talked about your dad getting that new restaurant in Little Tokyo, and he bought it from a...

FS: Yamatoda.

TI: Yeah, Yamatoda.

FS: He was a yakuza boss.

TI: Right. So can you describe a little bit about the, sort of the gangster element?

FS: Yamatoda was his name, he was a yakuza, he was the boss, and he controlled the Yamato Hall, that's where they had the gambling. And then he was the head of the Nichibei Shojigaishiu, some kind of company. He had three or four company. And then he controlled the sumo; there was a lot of betting on in sumo. Not judo, sumo. And sumo is more like a, what do you call it, gambling circle sport. Most of the people that attend sumo are gamblers.

TI: And so they're betting on each match.

FS: Yeah. And so that's where the gambler comes in, and he was taking all the bets.

TI: When you say he would control sumo, I mean, what relationship did he have with the actual wrestlers?

FS: He didn't have no contract, or nothing, but he just was in this, his henchmen, people were the stands picking up bets. It had nothing to do with the sumo player itself, because once you control the sumo player, then it's no fun, because the people know the yakuza control the player. So Yamatoda was very smart in that. He left the sumo players themselves alone, and controlled the betting. So was having two people go against each other and he was the House.

TI: So it didn't matter who won...

FS: No, it didn't matter.

TI: He just got a little cut. And besides gambling with sumo, what other things would Yamatoda...

FS: All the community, farming community... see, in prewar farm communities, most of the farm people were Japanese immigrants, single people, a lot of family people, they live in shacks, you know. So payday, I don't know when, once a week, twice a week, twice a month, I don't know. Payday, Yamatoda would send a gang of leaders, you know, all those gambling, ten, twelve people, lookouts and protect, and the House, they'll set up gambling. So once they get paid, "Oh, (...) come on in, try your luck." A few are good customers, he'd even give you a charge account. If you lose all that money, give you another ten dollars. But if you lose that ten dollars, you're out. But then if you're a real good, hard worker, but you're down on your luck, Yamatoda will come support you. What's that word? Give you help.

TI: Like loan, give you a loan?

FS: Yeah, yeah. Give you ten dollar, and he says, "Don't spend it, take it home." He says, he don't say "your wife," he said, "basan." You've heard that expression. "Basan motike" feed your kids. So the guys says, "Oh, thank you, thank you." So he's in debt to him for one whole week. So you go to Yamatoda next week and try to pay it off, he said, "What are you going to eat on?" So Yamatoda said, "Give me three dollars, but no betting, no gambling. Take that seven dollars and go home." So the next week when he gets paid, he got ten dollars, paid, now he come into the club. They either take all of it, or whatever.

TI: So he was wise in the sense that he knew that these people had to keep living their lives.

FS: Yeah, and knew how to get the money and make it keep coming. He didn't dry the well. When it get a little dry, put some water in there. Very smart man.

TI: So, Frank, you're telling me in pretty close detail all these things. How did you know all these things?

FS: Yeah, because I got summoned one day to his office. That's where actually my dad had a restaurant. I wet a guy's car, one of his vice presidents. And the chauffeur came onto the curbside where I was washing the duckboard, kitchen, walking, at that time it was spotless. Man, I could kiss the board, so clean. Man, I was proud. "I think my old man, he's going to say I'm, good job." And here it is, big old Packer come right into that curb and all that black water, right through that, every board was black. And I was rinsing the last board with a hose, long hose. I went across the street with the running water and went and doused the driver. Then the guy in the back said," What are you doing?" "Nani shiteru?" So I got him and I wet him like this. I just held it there. Then he went and told the boss what I did. So then I got summoned. The same guy that got together in camp later on, gambling, Kinowaki, his name was Kinowaki. He says, "Boss want to see you." So, "Oh, I'm going to get it now."

TI: And at this point, how old were you right now?

FS: That was just before the war broke out.

TI: So about sixteen years old, fifteen, sixteen?

FS: 1940 I was, what, fifteen?

TI: Fifteen, okay. Fifteen years old, okay. So continue the story.

FS: So I had to go up three floors. Each floor was a door with a bodyguard. I mean, you know, "What do you want?" Said, "What do you want?" Third floor, black guy. He quit the police force, he became Yamatoda's private bodyguard. He said, "Oh, it's you, Frank. Old man wants to see you pretty bad." He talked English, can't talk Japanese. I said, "Yeah?" He said, "Come on in." So I sit in front of Yamatoda, he was doing some paperwork, and made me wait about five minutes. I was getting ready to go home. He looked up and he says, "Oh..." I could say this now because at that time, all I could go on is remembrance of... Japanese I could understand if someone's speaking it, but I couldn't speak it. It was funny, I was able to understand it. So what he said to me at that time was that, "You have a lot of guts, huh?" "(Do kyo) aru na?" I didn't say nothing. He said, "You know what you did?" I said, "Yes." "Doushitara ii ka?" What can I do to you?" He said, "Why did you do it?" "Doushita yata no?" He said, "You explain why." "I spent two hours cleaning that duckboard. I wanted my old man to be proud, you know?" "Jiman." He said, "Okay." So he stood up, and he gave me five bucks. He didn't scold me or nothing, he just gave me five bucks and said, "You go home." So I couldn't figure that out, why he didn't scold me, but he gave me five bucks. But I think what he saying to me, he said I had a lot of guts. [Laughs] So that's my memory of Yamatoda. He was a gangster, but every time I see him, he used to wave to me from that day on. He never said anything, just see him in a car, walking, or coming to my dad's restaurant, he'd always come to the kitchen and looked at me and go like that. [Waves] Go back to his table. That's one thing I don't understand either, why he did that. There's a lot of things in life I don't understand.

TI: And how large, I mean, so he had his group. Were there other groups that competed against him?

FS: Oh, yeah, Sacramento, Bay Area, Seattle. You name it, wherever there was a concentration of Japanese, yakuza was there

TI: in Little Tokyo, this was his territory?

FS: Yeah, Little Tokyo, and wherever else he could stretch. And I think he went to Santa Maria, where Minami had, Minami was the biggest farmer in America, Japanese. He was so big in acreage, I don't know how many acreage, he had hundreds of Japanese people working. And to this date, I don't think nobody has his quality in his brains. He was the only one that had a ice-making plant on his premises.

TI: Oh, so you're talking about Minami.

FS: Yeah, Minami. And he had a railroad siding, and it came into his warehouse.

TI: But going back to Yamatoda, how large was his organization?

FS: I think at one time, I think he must have had almost a hundred people, straight out. But he had all kinds of dealing, now. I think he had a racket, protection racket, etcetera.

TI: And you mentioned his offices were close to the restaurant?

FS: Yeah, you could see it. I used to bring him meals, Saturday and Sunday. That's how I first got introduced to him, and then I messed up later. So he knew who I was.

TI: When you say you messed up, what happened?

FS: When I got water, sprayed the water.

TI: Oh, I see.

FS: So he knew who I was.

TI: And so he would order from your father's restaurant and you would bring food up to...

FS: Yeah, then I'd bring it up. I'd bring them lunch, I'd take the breakfast back, bring the supper, I'd take the lunch back. Next day, Sunday, breakfast, I'd take the last night's supper.

<End Segment 9> - Copyright © 2009 Densho. All Rights Reserved.